I think the FOs of many pro teams are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They intentionally market potential and personalities. They want fans to love the players. Many smaller cities / clubs have fans who are "all in" and super emotionally invested in the players as people. Heck, I am even seeing this with Gio right now and people who want to point fingers and make excuses, who think Gio's personality and past "almosts" (and yeah, I guess the COVID cup) should be enough to grant him something akin to academic tenure - even if currently failing.
Fans get attached and I think FOs like Portland's have to consider that when making changes. It does hinder their competitiveness when they have to consider fan backlash. There probably are certain players who are essentially untouchable at their prime AND the team is successful simultaneously. I mean who wants a team to be one of the best in the league and move their best player out with no reasonable plan to bring in something better immediately? However right now is NOT that moment for PTFC, so as you said elsewhere, every player is potentially movable, no matter how painful that may be (D. Chara would be the most painful for me personally, so I would hope what happened is we bring in a 23 year old destroyer 6 and he becomes the backup, transitioning to a FO position in a couple of years).
Agree with you that a hot run at the right moment was Gio's peak. Our performance during the Leagues Cup suggested we were trying to do the same, but just were not good enough (which is what happens to older teams who are clearly on the back side of their excellence window). That window was closing rapidly in 2021 and we still managed to find some magic at the right moment and luck our way into hosting MLS cup due to many upsets in the East. We didn't go out and find players better than Valeri, Chara, Adi, etc ... we tried to continue to do it with journeymen who were good, but not great.
100% on your D. Chara take. I would love for him to be a backup, spot-starter 6 the next year or two who mentors his replacement, be it Ayala or someone else. Then retires, stays with the team in some capacity and makes Portland his permanent home. The sticking points are that both he and the team have to realize that that's the best move for him and the team in the transition to the new era. And that he's okay with Yimmi being moved out of a DP slot or moved on from TImbers altogether. Might be a tough sell.
If the only thing keeping Diego Chara happy right now is that his brother plays here, the Timbers have done a lot of things very wrong. This is a business; Y Chara's out of contract, so his status will by necessity change. I personally hope it changes to "he's wearing a different shirt next year", but Diego's a professional athlete and understands how this all works, so hopefully can handle whatever happens to his brother.
Yimmi is under contract next year. I think I saw something on transfrmarket once that showed it (and not always reliable), but people I trust all say he's still under contract next year.
I hope you're right. Also there's the fact that Diego was brought in as a DP and is no longer, so maybe he'd understand it as the natural progression as you get older and the team looks to improve by opening up DP slots. That's if Timbers want to bring Yimmi back at all. I'm pretty much 50/50 at this point re: bringing him back at a lesser contract or not resigning him at all.
I am 100/0 to not bring him back. I'm also not sure why the Timbers have to/would ever make roster moves only once they consider the feelings of other players on the roster.
I would certainly hope they don't. But Yimmi was signed as a DP when there wasn't a lot of demand for him in MLS (at least as a DP), or other major leagues, as I recall, so maybe just a coincidence that his brother is a club legend?
Oh, not at all - he was signed in no small part because Diego wanted him here. And I hated it at that point, and I hate it even more now.
It would have been fine if YC had been cheaper and better. Or even one of the two. But here we are, three years in, and he's overpriced and not good enough, and even DC should know that's not a recipe for sticking around, brother or otherwise. If losing YC from the team makes Diego that upset, well, maybe it's time for DC to collect his well-earned flowers as well, because sentimentality should not be a roster construction consideration.
"Timbers have the strange habit of selling well before a player hits their stride (Jebo, Farfan just off the top of my head)"
I fully and totally blame Gio for the Jebo sale. He refused to play him in his best position and insisted on playing him out wide, despite plenty of evidence that he wasn't as effective out there, until Jebo finally got sick enough of that to want out.
Portland does have an "insular" issue, I think, but Jebo's not a case of that, his was all about Gio not playing him to his best.
"2021 Cup final was nice but for those keen to this stuff, it was Gio's ceiling not a new dawn."
I think the FOs of many pro teams are stuck between a rock and a hard place. They intentionally market potential and personalities. They want fans to love the players. Many smaller cities / clubs have fans who are "all in" and super emotionally invested in the players as people. Heck, I am even seeing this with Gio right now and people who want to point fingers and make excuses, who think Gio's personality and past "almosts" (and yeah, I guess the COVID cup) should be enough to grant him something akin to academic tenure - even if currently failing.
Fans get attached and I think FOs like Portland's have to consider that when making changes. It does hinder their competitiveness when they have to consider fan backlash. There probably are certain players who are essentially untouchable at their prime AND the team is successful simultaneously. I mean who wants a team to be one of the best in the league and move their best player out with no reasonable plan to bring in something better immediately? However right now is NOT that moment for PTFC, so as you said elsewhere, every player is potentially movable, no matter how painful that may be (D. Chara would be the most painful for me personally, so I would hope what happened is we bring in a 23 year old destroyer 6 and he becomes the backup, transitioning to a FO position in a couple of years).
Agree with you that a hot run at the right moment was Gio's peak. Our performance during the Leagues Cup suggested we were trying to do the same, but just were not good enough (which is what happens to older teams who are clearly on the back side of their excellence window). That window was closing rapidly in 2021 and we still managed to find some magic at the right moment and luck our way into hosting MLS cup due to many upsets in the East. We didn't go out and find players better than Valeri, Chara, Adi, etc ... we tried to continue to do it with journeymen who were good, but not great.
I'm 100% here for Diego Chara moving into the role of Head of Conditioning and Chief Chocolate Chip Cookie Officer.
Cmon you have to keep the alliteration going, itтАЩs Chief Chocolate Chip Cookie Captain!
I'll allow it!
100% on your D. Chara take. I would love for him to be a backup, spot-starter 6 the next year or two who mentors his replacement, be it Ayala or someone else. Then retires, stays with the team in some capacity and makes Portland his permanent home. The sticking points are that both he and the team have to realize that that's the best move for him and the team in the transition to the new era. And that he's okay with Yimmi being moved out of a DP slot or moved on from TImbers altogether. Might be a tough sell.
If the only thing keeping Diego Chara happy right now is that his brother plays here, the Timbers have done a lot of things very wrong. This is a business; Y Chara's out of contract, so his status will by necessity change. I personally hope it changes to "he's wearing a different shirt next year", but Diego's a professional athlete and understands how this all works, so hopefully can handle whatever happens to his brother.
Yimmi is under contract next year. I think I saw something on transfrmarket once that showed it (and not always reliable), but people I trust all say he's still under contract next year.
I have no inside info, but everything I've seen online, including this site which I trust, says 2023 - https://www.capology.com/club/portland-timbers/salaries/2023/
It may be that there's an option year after this or something, but every site I've seen says his contract ends in December.
I guess we'll see which site is correct in a few months. https://www.transfermarkt.us/portland-timbers/vertragsende/verein/4291/vertragsendeJahr/2023/plus/1
I was also thinking he might have a player option.
I hope you're right. Also there's the fact that Diego was brought in as a DP and is no longer, so maybe he'd understand it as the natural progression as you get older and the team looks to improve by opening up DP slots. That's if Timbers want to bring Yimmi back at all. I'm pretty much 50/50 at this point re: bringing him back at a lesser contract or not resigning him at all.
Diego was a DP only because of his transfer fee. Once that was paid off, he wasn't a DP anymore. He's been incredibly cheap for us given his quality.
No question he's been a bargain. One of the best in the history of the league.
I am 100/0 to not bring him back. I'm also not sure why the Timbers have to/would ever make roster moves only once they consider the feelings of other players on the roster.
I would certainly hope they don't. But Yimmi was signed as a DP when there wasn't a lot of demand for him in MLS (at least as a DP), or other major leagues, as I recall, so maybe just a coincidence that his brother is a club legend?
Oh, not at all - he was signed in no small part because Diego wanted him here. And I hated it at that point, and I hate it even more now.
It would have been fine if YC had been cheaper and better. Or even one of the two. But here we are, three years in, and he's overpriced and not good enough, and even DC should know that's not a recipe for sticking around, brother or otherwise. If losing YC from the team makes Diego that upset, well, maybe it's time for DC to collect his well-earned flowers as well, because sentimentality should not be a roster construction consideration.
"Timbers have the strange habit of selling well before a player hits their stride (Jebo, Farfan just off the top of my head)"
I fully and totally blame Gio for the Jebo sale. He refused to play him in his best position and insisted on playing him out wide, despite plenty of evidence that he wasn't as effective out there, until Jebo finally got sick enough of that to want out.
Portland does have an "insular" issue, I think, but Jebo's not a case of that, his was all about Gio not playing him to his best.
"2021 Cup final was nice but for those keen to this stuff, it was Gio's ceiling not a new dawn."
Yep.