If the recap is going to editorialize ("What he did to earn the red card was childish and can't happen again"), at least describe the offense. Those of us who were at the stadium only saw a brief replay that was very ambiguous--in fact it looked to me as if it could have been accidental. If consensus is that it wasn't, I want to hear why…
If the recap is going to editorialize ("What he did to earn the red card was childish and can't happen again"), at least describe the offense. Those of us who were at the stadium only saw a brief replay that was very ambiguous--in fact it looked to me as if it could have been accidental. If consensus is that it wasn't, I want to hear why. I don't come to StumptownFooty just for the comments, interesting as they often are. I also want to know what I missed, either at the stadium or at home, and I can't trust the official MLS and Timbers sites to tell me without bias.
(And what does "I guess these are the cards the Timbers have to deal with nowadays" mean, exactly?)
Evander's Hand came down on the Tigres player's head. The replay I saw looked like it brushed his head, but the Tigres player went down like he was beaten by a baseball bat. My best guess on the card was that the ref saw the hand near the head and the response, and carded him for hitting the player in the head. Since it was a yellow card, I don't think it was reviewable so the red stands regardless of what could have been seen on the replay. Soft foul, and the ultimate result was far harsher than the infraction warranted. But as others have said, once you are on a yellow card you have to be careful.
My take on the calls, Evander should have been given a talking to on the first yellow, and then a yellow is warranted on the second. But to pull cards that quickly when the ref wasn't earlier (the Tigres fouls) was too harsh.
Hard to say Evander deserves a yellow card for the challenge when it isn’t even a foul and parades is bleeding from the nose.
The ref instigated during the first half instead of being a calming influence. And his worst offense to me was he was not consistent. Be bad if you want or whatever but be consistent.
I agree on your take on the second yellow, but differ a little bit on the first. I don't like to see any blows to the head, and the first one, whether he intended it or not, was an elbow or at least bicep to the head and looked like he caught him pretty good. I can see a talking too on one end of the spectrum and then a yellow on the other end. The ref went the other end, and once he does, Evander should be more careful.
I suspect Evander gets frustrated with himself for losing the ball and acts out sometimes. He seems like a perfectionist, which is good for a leader, but he needs to control the negative impulses.
I can see that. Part of my perspective is that the ref wasn't pulling yellows on hard fouls earlier, so I didn't understand why he did there. But a blow to the head can definitely warrant a yellow. The calls are defensible, but harsh. And the calls influenced the outcome of the game, which is not what a ref should be doing.
I’m pretty sure that you are correct about the yellow card not being eligible for VAR. I think all yellows should be reviewable, maybe with a coaches’ challenge if there are just too many yellow cards. At a minimum, when a yellow card leads to a red card and an ejection (and a team playing shorthanded) that yellow needs to be reviewed. The result is the same as a straight red card, which can be reviewed.
I agree with you, but it has been this way for years and I don't see it stopping.
Most yellow card infractions are subjective "in the opinion of the referee" as are many reds (DOGSO for example).
Review is fairly pointless if the CR is going to maintain his opinion that any arm to head contact is reckless (or even that it was in this case and no matter how many TV replays you see you are not going to change that subjective opinion made in the moment).
It is true that 2 yellows is definitely a catch-22 to the idea that VAR will fix bad calls, because it can't fix most yellow offenses.
If the recap is going to editorialize ("What he did to earn the red card was childish and can't happen again"), at least describe the offense. Those of us who were at the stadium only saw a brief replay that was very ambiguous--in fact it looked to me as if it could have been accidental. If consensus is that it wasn't, I want to hear why. I don't come to StumptownFooty just for the comments, interesting as they often are. I also want to know what I missed, either at the stadium or at home, and I can't trust the official MLS and Timbers sites to tell me without bias.
(And what does "I guess these are the cards the Timbers have to deal with nowadays" mean, exactly?)
Evander's Hand came down on the Tigres player's head. The replay I saw looked like it brushed his head, but the Tigres player went down like he was beaten by a baseball bat. My best guess on the card was that the ref saw the hand near the head and the response, and carded him for hitting the player in the head. Since it was a yellow card, I don't think it was reviewable so the red stands regardless of what could have been seen on the replay. Soft foul, and the ultimate result was far harsher than the infraction warranted. But as others have said, once you are on a yellow card you have to be careful.
My take on the calls, Evander should have been given a talking to on the first yellow, and then a yellow is warranted on the second. But to pull cards that quickly when the ref wasn't earlier (the Tigres fouls) was too harsh.
Hard to say Evander deserves a yellow card for the challenge when it isn’t even a foul and parades is bleeding from the nose.
The ref instigated during the first half instead of being a calming influence. And his worst offense to me was he was not consistent. Be bad if you want or whatever but be consistent.
I agree on your take on the second yellow, but differ a little bit on the first. I don't like to see any blows to the head, and the first one, whether he intended it or not, was an elbow or at least bicep to the head and looked like he caught him pretty good. I can see a talking too on one end of the spectrum and then a yellow on the other end. The ref went the other end, and once he does, Evander should be more careful.
I suspect Evander gets frustrated with himself for losing the ball and acts out sometimes. He seems like a perfectionist, which is good for a leader, but he needs to control the negative impulses.
I can see that. Part of my perspective is that the ref wasn't pulling yellows on hard fouls earlier, so I didn't understand why he did there. But a blow to the head can definitely warrant a yellow. The calls are defensible, but harsh. And the calls influenced the outcome of the game, which is not what a ref should be doing.
I’m pretty sure that you are correct about the yellow card not being eligible for VAR. I think all yellows should be reviewable, maybe with a coaches’ challenge if there are just too many yellow cards. At a minimum, when a yellow card leads to a red card and an ejection (and a team playing shorthanded) that yellow needs to be reviewed. The result is the same as a straight red card, which can be reviewed.
I agree with you, but it has been this way for years and I don't see it stopping.
Most yellow card infractions are subjective "in the opinion of the referee" as are many reds (DOGSO for example).
Review is fairly pointless if the CR is going to maintain his opinion that any arm to head contact is reckless (or even that it was in this case and no matter how many TV replays you see you are not going to change that subjective opinion made in the moment).
It is true that 2 yellows is definitely a catch-22 to the idea that VAR will fix bad calls, because it can't fix most yellow offenses.
The best breakdown can be found here. Decide for yourself.
https://youtu.be/AE3o6X-9gnk
Thanks for the link!