Finding myself pissed off at Gale’s accountability-less pressers every week, so Rob, buddy, here’s some free coachspeak consulting for ya:
“I thought we played quite well in certain areas of the field, specifically the midfield where I thought Sam, Jessie, and Liv were excellent and controlled much of the game. With that said, we continue to fail to generate enough chances to win games and it’s on me as the manager to do better and figure it out. I haven’t been good enough and I have to be better as manager to get the best out of this team.”
Both he and Karina strike me very much as “nothing is ever the matter” type of people. The idea that to admit a problem is to admit defeat. Having a positive mentality is a good thing, but when you’re unwilling or unable to acknowledge a problem when everybody else in the room knows it’s a problem (even if you’re just trying to be positive), that can quickly go from “optimism” to “delusion”.
I know a few people like this irl, and it gets old fast. If it’s true that Karina has become a divisive figure internally, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if that personality trait is at the root of it. Because I’m also completely out of patience for it as it relates to Rob’s public-facing comments.
Yes, yes, yes. I said after some recent failure that taking responsibility for this mess is the only thing we'd respect him for professionally at this point.
I get that the job might be a grind beyond my imagination, and beyond my layperson's understanding of game strategy, along w/ the fact one could be terminated at any given time (well, in most cases). But publicly owning up to being at fault for this dismal run? That's the easy bit, Rob.
An inspirational refrain from a fellow Brit, going out to RG: "Problem, the problem is you! What you gonna do?"
Gale’s pressers remind me of the memoirs that German generals wrote after the world wars about how they had won every battle and how it was the Kaiser’s/Hitler’s faults that they’d lost.
The war IS the goal, ma dudes. Battles, midfields, goals, possession…don’t mean shit if you can’t consistently turn them into wins.
It’s that stuff that convinces me that Ken is an assistant-grade coach. He can’t see the big picture. He fiddles pointlessly with lineups without really understanding what he’s supposed to accomplish.
Don't forget playing out of the back without triangles. Default pass in the midfield is square or backward. Almost never crossing from the wings. Goalkeeping derps. General lack of urgency.
Fleming generally had a good game, but to my eyes there were several times when she just didn't anticipate Flint's size and thus made passes that went right to her or that Flint was able to get a leg out and block.
Yep. I mean, it was actually heartening to see them string together long sequences of passes and possess the ball for long stretches -- bearing in mind that Loovull weren't exactly putting max pressure on them. But yeah, nothing that translated to a road point, let alone a win. Nothing but leaving themselves vulnerable to losing at the end in the most predictable way -- kick it to the tall girl, who heads it in against you time after time.
The passing-around-the-back-up-the-flanks-in-out-then-back thing is something most opponents are happy to let us waste time doing once they figure out we can't effectively pass THROUGH them, or, if we do, no one gets to the pass to create danger. That final pass or run-and-pass either isn't there, or even on the rare occasions it is the shot isn't.
That's the whole "possession with purpose" cliche'. We can possess often only as long as it's not threatening.
Hayes praised Smith tonight for becoming the striker that she wants her to become.
My own view is that if we can't get Smith a better supporting cast, she will go somewhere else so that she can become the striker that Hayes wants her to become.
This is no different than any other reason why she'd leave, really. If they don't show her they want to win and are serious about it, she'll probably go elsewhere. If they do, there's a decent chance she'll stick around. Hell, if a player is in danger of losing their spot because their club situation isn't advancing their growth properly, sorry Naomi Girma, Jaedyn Shaw, Sam Coffey, and Alyssa Thompson, you're getting dropped too!
(In other words, I'd be more worried about her leaving because she's tired of losing, not because she feels like she's in danger of getting dropped from the nats. There's certainly a growth part of that, but I think she's already at the point where she ain't getting dropped so long as she's healthy and playing)
She'd have to be VERY careful with her choice of team, though. It simply has to be a team legitimately competing the championship of a league that matters...and that's actually not a big selection in Yurrp. To wit:
FAWSL? Looks like Chelsea or City (I don't think United or Brighton will stay with those two). Easy starter at Chelsea...right now. But with Kerr and Macario back, it's not so straightforward. City? I love Soph, but I'm not sure even I would start her in the middle over Bunny Shaw. As a wing? Competing with Viv Miedema, Mary Fowler, and Aoba Fujino. No guaranteed start/minutes there...and playing as a winger doesn't really match with her USWNT direction (or at least it bloody well shouldn't).
L1F? Lyon might be attractive, pairing up w/ Horan. Would Soph displace Hegerberg in the preferred 11? Or play on the wing, which again, isn't ideal for her USWNT purposes. More room at PSG, but will they really stay competitive w/ Lyon as the season rolls on?
Liga F is Barca (yes, RM and Atletico are close now...they won't stay there). I think Soph could fight for a place in the 11 in the center for Barca (I think she can beat out Hansen). Honestly probably her best option. A team heading in the wrong direction (City just obliterated them in the UWCL group opener) but still absolute giants.
SAF is basically Roma. Might not be a good enough league to tempt her; same with FBL in Germany. For that matter, the WE League is second only to the NWSL in terms of depth (and might actually be better right now in that aspect) and could teach her a lot about technical, coordinated offensive play, but it's too poor for any team to be able to afford a player like her. Almost a pity, as it would be poetic justice for the plundering to actually go in Beleza's favor for a change (and the prospect of pairing Sophia Smith with wunderkind CAM Miharu Shinjo is mind-blowing).
I keep thinking we'll lose Soph...then I realize I'm not sure just _where_ she might go that's actually a better choice (assuming the FO will simply not consider a domestic deal...which I suppose isn't set in stone).
Interesting tidbit here about the random hiring of the new assistant- "After the Thorns’ loss to Utah, Gale alluded to the amount of time it took the club to bring assistant coach Stephen Hart on board. “It’s taken a lot longer than we wanted for various reasons,” Gale told the media."
I think at this point he has to be his own man, for a few reasons. One is that she's no longer going to have a say in soccer operations. Although it souinds like a word salad to me, "Strategic Growth Development" is actually a thing, and it's about the biz planning for Thorns and Portland WNBA, not about soccer ops. So, whether or not he has a job here after the playoffs end, Gale is no longer directly influenced by Karina. At least that's my take on it.
Is it just me, or do "strategic" and "Karina LeBlanc" really not go together? She just doesn't seem like a strategic business planner kind of person. Maybe she can learn it, but learning on the job didn't seem to happen for the Thorns.
The job description was encouraging, just because it confirmed it was a high ranking business ops position. My biggest concern is that she might still have a minor impact in the GM hiring process even if it's just Lisa asking her "hey what do you think?" But hopefully that's not the case.
Could be well-earned…..or it could be that they gave him good players instead of the bad ones they gave A-Rod and it’ll end up being another Tweed/Gale style interim hiring disaster!
Never saw any evidence A-Rod could coach her way out of a wet paper bag, but new club in flux all season makes any comparison fraught. Whatever they did, their moves were correct ones.
Sure, but one coach had a winger combo of Brecken Mozingo and Paige Monaghan while the other got Cloe Lacasse and Mina Tanaka. One had a central midfield duo of Dana Foederer and Agnes Nyberg while the other had Ana Tejada and Claudia Zornoza.
So, who knows if Rodriguez was any good, but she was 100% capital S screwed out of any chance to show what she had by her FO.
I've only watched like 10 minutes of this U23 Germany v France game, and the German U23 team already has much better passing than the Thorns lol. I think the German model would be a good coaching fit for the NWSL, btw...
She's the complete package, Muller mit umlaut. Skills, vision, calm in a storm. Can't wait to see how much further she can develop, given her tender 23ish age.
Pitch with no seating has better turf than any NWSL park, from appearances.
ETA kept video running and just heard "Ja-ja-ja!" which surprises there are still German Beatles fans.
Have never read an inside story re. how he managed to convince her to leave Stanford early and become the #1 draft pick. That he was so taken with both Soph and Morgan that he finagled acquiring both picks to take them 1-2 is known, and speaks to his eye for talent and sufficient empathetic qualities to sense how they will be as teammates and pros.
I suffered a concussion when I hit my head on my desk. Smith and Weaver needed to rest their legs, so I would do what Gale did. I started with the weakest line-up that I could. That way, there would be no possiblity of scoring a goal in the first half to put Louisville on the back foot.
She is good! I enjoyed her analysis. I had wondered why I was seeing Girma so much in the attack. but I only saw the replays. From O'Toole's analysis that was evidently a feature, not an accident and a clever one using one of the best players on the field more comprehensively.
They've still retained most of their talent tbf- Brand, Jonsdottir, Sellner, Hegering, Hendrichs, Frohms, and Popp. They even brought in both Marie's old friend Janina Minge from Freiburg, and Vivien Endemann who's super highly rated as well, so the financial issues may have been vaguely exaggerated lol
Without knowing anything about Wolfsburg's financials, I just meant that I'm surprised an even bigger club hasn't snatched her up yet on talent/ceiling alone. I could say the same about Brand, but she's German so it makes a bit more sense. Would love either!
Unlike the men, Wolfsburg has been comfortably the biggest women's club in Germany (and really only behind Lyon until the emergence of Barca and Chelsea in recent years) in all of Europe for the last decade. Not really sure why that is or how it came about, but they're traditionally at or near the top of the Euro woso food chain.
They had a weirdly awful season last year and lost Oberdorf to Bayern (brutal) and Pajor to Barca among rumors of some financial issues, so they're definitely not what they once were and have probably gotten passed up by Bayern in recent years. Still probably a top 6-7 Euro club on reputation though.
What bugs me about this is that 1) yes, it's "possession without purpose", but 2) Ken calls this "domination". Dude! That's pretty much the visual description of "pointless passing back and forth". That's dominating jack shit.
Finding myself pissed off at Gale’s accountability-less pressers every week, so Rob, buddy, here’s some free coachspeak consulting for ya:
“I thought we played quite well in certain areas of the field, specifically the midfield where I thought Sam, Jessie, and Liv were excellent and controlled much of the game. With that said, we continue to fail to generate enough chances to win games and it’s on me as the manager to do better and figure it out. I haven’t been good enough and I have to be better as manager to get the best out of this team.”
Both he and Karina strike me very much as “nothing is ever the matter” type of people. The idea that to admit a problem is to admit defeat. Having a positive mentality is a good thing, but when you’re unwilling or unable to acknowledge a problem when everybody else in the room knows it’s a problem (even if you’re just trying to be positive), that can quickly go from “optimism” to “delusion”.
I know a few people like this irl, and it gets old fast. If it’s true that Karina has become a divisive figure internally, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if that personality trait is at the root of it. Because I’m also completely out of patience for it as it relates to Rob’s public-facing comments.
Yes, yes, yes. I said after some recent failure that taking responsibility for this mess is the only thing we'd respect him for professionally at this point.
I get that the job might be a grind beyond my imagination, and beyond my layperson's understanding of game strategy, along w/ the fact one could be terminated at any given time (well, in most cases). But publicly owning up to being at fault for this dismal run? That's the easy bit, Rob.
An inspirational refrain from a fellow Brit, going out to RG: "Problem, the problem is you! What you gonna do?"
Gale’s pressers remind me of the memoirs that German generals wrote after the world wars about how they had won every battle and how it was the Kaiser’s/Hitler’s faults that they’d lost.
The war IS the goal, ma dudes. Battles, midfields, goals, possession…don’t mean shit if you can’t consistently turn them into wins.
It’s that stuff that convinces me that Ken is an assistant-grade coach. He can’t see the big picture. He fiddles pointlessly with lineups without really understanding what he’s supposed to accomplish.
Hopefully Rob will face the ultimate accountability shortly after the season ends.
At this point it seems almost pointless to write anything about this stuff.
What can we say we haven't repeated a dozen times.
Slow, disjointed, under-trained "attack"? Check.
Failure to move quickly to space? Check.
Failure to pick out runners that DO find space? Check.
Lack of organization and discipline? Check.
Failure to put the boot to poor opponents? Check.
Shipping crap goal(s) off defensive error(s)? Check.
Players out of position? Check.
Inexplicable roster/XI decisions? Check.
There was a point where all this management failure pissed me off.
Now? It's just tiring.
I'm sick of watching this junk.
Don't forget playing out of the back without triangles. Default pass in the midfield is square or backward. Almost never crossing from the wings. Goalkeeping derps. General lack of urgency.
Check!
Fleming generally had a good game, but to my eyes there were several times when she just didn't anticipate Flint's size and thus made passes that went right to her or that Flint was able to get a leg out and block.
Oh, and...
"So-and-so played well" but the squad as a whole was ineffective? Check.
Yep. I mean, it was actually heartening to see them string together long sequences of passes and possess the ball for long stretches -- bearing in mind that Loovull weren't exactly putting max pressure on them. But yeah, nothing that translated to a road point, let alone a win. Nothing but leaving themselves vulnerable to losing at the end in the most predictable way -- kick it to the tall girl, who heads it in against you time after time.
The passing-around-the-back-up-the-flanks-in-out-then-back thing is something most opponents are happy to let us waste time doing once they figure out we can't effectively pass THROUGH them, or, if we do, no one gets to the pass to create danger. That final pass or run-and-pass either isn't there, or even on the rare occasions it is the shot isn't.
That's the whole "possession with purpose" cliche'. We can possess often only as long as it's not threatening.
Gale imagines a Flint who's 5'7" then plans for that.
Hayes praised Smith tonight for becoming the striker that she wants her to become.
My own view is that if we can't get Smith a better supporting cast, she will go somewhere else so that she can become the striker that Hayes wants her to become.
This is no different than any other reason why she'd leave, really. If they don't show her they want to win and are serious about it, she'll probably go elsewhere. If they do, there's a decent chance she'll stick around. Hell, if a player is in danger of losing their spot because their club situation isn't advancing their growth properly, sorry Naomi Girma, Jaedyn Shaw, Sam Coffey, and Alyssa Thompson, you're getting dropped too!
(In other words, I'd be more worried about her leaving because she's tired of losing, not because she feels like she's in danger of getting dropped from the nats. There's certainly a growth part of that, but I think she's already at the point where she ain't getting dropped so long as she's healthy and playing)
She'd have to be VERY careful with her choice of team, though. It simply has to be a team legitimately competing the championship of a league that matters...and that's actually not a big selection in Yurrp. To wit:
FAWSL? Looks like Chelsea or City (I don't think United or Brighton will stay with those two). Easy starter at Chelsea...right now. But with Kerr and Macario back, it's not so straightforward. City? I love Soph, but I'm not sure even I would start her in the middle over Bunny Shaw. As a wing? Competing with Viv Miedema, Mary Fowler, and Aoba Fujino. No guaranteed start/minutes there...and playing as a winger doesn't really match with her USWNT direction (or at least it bloody well shouldn't).
L1F? Lyon might be attractive, pairing up w/ Horan. Would Soph displace Hegerberg in the preferred 11? Or play on the wing, which again, isn't ideal for her USWNT purposes. More room at PSG, but will they really stay competitive w/ Lyon as the season rolls on?
Liga F is Barca (yes, RM and Atletico are close now...they won't stay there). I think Soph could fight for a place in the 11 in the center for Barca (I think she can beat out Hansen). Honestly probably her best option. A team heading in the wrong direction (City just obliterated them in the UWCL group opener) but still absolute giants.
SAF is basically Roma. Might not be a good enough league to tempt her; same with FBL in Germany. For that matter, the WE League is second only to the NWSL in terms of depth (and might actually be better right now in that aspect) and could teach her a lot about technical, coordinated offensive play, but it's too poor for any team to be able to afford a player like her. Almost a pity, as it would be poetic justice for the plundering to actually go in Beleza's favor for a change (and the prospect of pairing Sophia Smith with wunderkind CAM Miharu Shinjo is mind-blowing).
I keep thinking we'll lose Soph...then I realize I'm not sure just _where_ she might go that's actually a better choice (assuming the FO will simply not consider a domestic deal...which I suppose isn't set in stone).
All our defenders scoring in Europe this week good lord
https://x.com/dbulandshold/status/1849862763327463562
Y'all, I think it's just Gale (tbf it was 6-0 and still doesn't change my opinion of Sheva lol):
https://x.com/ThornsFC/status/1849882007603642392
Jeeeezus Soph whata goal
All righty Soph a couple of those at home next week, and the week after, and the week after, and all next year.
That really was a beauty.
New WW from Leo:
https://www.wweek.com/sports/2024/10/23/thorns-general-manager-karina-leblanc-leaves-behind-more-questions-than-answers/
Interesting tidbit here about the random hiring of the new assistant- "After the Thorns’ loss to Utah, Gale alluded to the amount of time it took the club to bring assistant coach Stephen Hart on board. “It’s taken a lot longer than we wanted for various reasons,” Gale told the media."
Feels validating as a fan to finally see this (correct, IMO) sentiment expressed in the media. Thank you Leo Baudhuin!
Thanks for bouncing that up. I posted that along with another article last night. I think it got lost in the shuffle, and it deserves more attention.
Yes, I hadn't seen it! Things can get buried quickly here, so hopefully between the two of us it was read!
I thought that quote was interesting. I wonder if Gale/KK's relationship has soured a little...I'd say this was mostly pointed at the FO/GM?
I think at this point he has to be his own man, for a few reasons. One is that she's no longer going to have a say in soccer operations. Although it souinds like a word salad to me, "Strategic Growth Development" is actually a thing, and it's about the biz planning for Thorns and Portland WNBA, not about soccer ops. So, whether or not he has a job here after the playoffs end, Gale is no longer directly influenced by Karina. At least that's my take on it.
Is it just me, or do "strategic" and "Karina LeBlanc" really not go together? She just doesn't seem like a strategic business planner kind of person. Maybe she can learn it, but learning on the job didn't seem to happen for the Thorns.
The job description was encouraging, just because it confirmed it was a high ranking business ops position. My biggest concern is that she might still have a minor impact in the GM hiring process even if it's just Lisa asking her "hey what do you think?" But hopefully that's not the case.
Jimmy Coenraets elevated to permanent HC of MagicJackMormons FC
Well earned given their turnaround. Plus, good clean livin' at no extra cost.
Could be well-earned…..or it could be that they gave him good players instead of the bad ones they gave A-Rod and it’ll end up being another Tweed/Gale style interim hiring disaster!
Never saw any evidence A-Rod could coach her way out of a wet paper bag, but new club in flux all season makes any comparison fraught. Whatever they did, their moves were correct ones.
Sure, but one coach had a winger combo of Brecken Mozingo and Paige Monaghan while the other got Cloe Lacasse and Mina Tanaka. One had a central midfield duo of Dana Foederer and Agnes Nyberg while the other had Ana Tejada and Claudia Zornoza.
So, who knows if Rodriguez was any good, but she was 100% capital S screwed out of any chance to show what she had by her FO.
I've only watched like 10 minutes of this U23 Germany v France game, and the German U23 team already has much better passing than the Thorns lol. I think the German model would be a good coaching fit for the NWSL, btw...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KhNXuIECys&t=1145s
*Bonus* Marie goal in the 9th minute! She starts at RB and looks like she's making a good case for more attention from the senior team.
She's the complete package, Muller mit umlaut. Skills, vision, calm in a storm. Can't wait to see how much further she can develop, given her tender 23ish age.
Pitch with no seating has better turf than any NWSL park, from appearances.
ETA kept video running and just heard "Ja-ja-ja!" which surprises there are still German Beatles fans.
https://youtu.be/YmjnK4zTBhM?si=TRTjyACAVIXnqr0r
Just saw this heartwarming picture of Mark and Sophia from when he came to PP as the Spirit coach last season
https://x.com/danteysart/status/1847817544155222273?s=46&t=e8Gx9bM3HEyE6UzYl-Lilw
Have never read an inside story re. how he managed to convince her to leave Stanford early and become the #1 draft pick. That he was so taken with both Soph and Morgan that he finagled acquiring both picks to take them 1-2 is known, and speaks to his eye for talent and sufficient empathetic qualities to sense how they will be as teammates and pros.
The next year he got Coffey and Yazmeen Ryan. He or someone he worked with knew talent.
He knew it, and Gavin got it.
I suffered a concussion when I hit my head on my desk. Smith and Weaver needed to rest their legs, so I would do what Gale did. I started with the weakest line-up that I could. That way, there would be no possiblity of scoring a goal in the first half to put Louisville on the back foot.
Really, really, really a good job.
Taylor Flint all-time NWSL: 15 goals - regular season, playoffs, cups
Taylor Flint against Portland: 6 goals - 3 regular season, 1 playoffs, 2 Challenge Cup
Bridie O'Toole has an interesting analysis of the US Women's tactics against Iceland:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRYLb722_e4
She is good! I enjoyed her analysis. I had wondered why I was seeing Girma so much in the attack. but I only saw the replays. From O'Toole's analysis that was evidently a feature, not an accident and a clever one using one of the best players on the field more comprehensively.
Ahh, I forgot my favorite pipe-dream winger signing is Icelandic! Keep an eye on Jonsdottir tonight y'all.
Yeah, I've been surprised Wolfsburg has been able to hang onto her. She'd be a great get.
They've still retained most of their talent tbf- Brand, Jonsdottir, Sellner, Hegering, Hendrichs, Frohms, and Popp. They even brought in both Marie's old friend Janina Minge from Freiburg, and Vivien Endemann who's super highly rated as well, so the financial issues may have been vaguely exaggerated lol
Without knowing anything about Wolfsburg's financials, I just meant that I'm surprised an even bigger club hasn't snatched her up yet on talent/ceiling alone. I could say the same about Brand, but she's German so it makes a bit more sense. Would love either!
Unlike the men, Wolfsburg has been comfortably the biggest women's club in Germany (and really only behind Lyon until the emergence of Barca and Chelsea in recent years) in all of Europe for the last decade. Not really sure why that is or how it came about, but they're traditionally at or near the top of the Euro woso food chain.
They had a weirdly awful season last year and lost Oberdorf to Bayern (brutal) and Pajor to Barca among rumors of some financial issues, so they're definitely not what they once were and have probably gotten passed up by Bayern in recent years. Still probably a top 6-7 Euro club on reputation though.
https://x.com/tombogert/status/1849521284155142159
Apologies for the Timbers content, but a PTFC cage match to see who can piss off their star more between Ned and KK might be in order.
WTAF? https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=10229099038435438&set=a.1043339998584
Looks exactly like what I saw: nothing cookin' in the attacking third, and lots of possession elsewhere but nothing productive.
What bugs me about this is that 1) yes, it's "possession without purpose", but 2) Ken calls this "domination". Dude! That's pretty much the visual description of "pointless passing back and forth". That's dominating jack shit.
Must stand for Where're The Actual Forwards? lol
Match report up: https://rivetingpdx.com/2024/10/22/thorns-fc-ssdd/
poor you!