Having that game, coming off a career-threatening injury and year of rehab? Thrilled for her and happy for the team. Now, figure how to best fit her in.
This is the question I am facing because when she is fully fit for 90 minutes, going to be hard to take her off the pitch. When healthy, she is a crossing and passing wizard. I think Hina starting and Janine finishing games would be a good start. However, if JB plays like we all know she can, she'll be a full-time starter in months or even weeks.
Another option is that Norris finally moves Hina to the 10, AND Beckie starts on the RW.
Sorry to say, but Liv is the player who kinda performed the least yesterday and is generally the more inconsistent player overall between her and Hina. If Beckie is gonna make noise on the RW and score goals and make Norris have to include her, then the positional battle returns to the 10. Who is performing better, Hina or Moultrie? At this point I'd def still go with Hina. Positional battles are GOOD though. We need this all over the field.
However, I DO think it'll be a while before Janine is 90 mins fit, so for now I think Hina will be sharing the RW with her. If Beckie continues to be a beast, I'd rather start with Hina at the 10 and Janine at RW. Then at half, if Janine has to come out, move Hina up to RW and bring in Liv at the 10.
Liv is just too inconsistent for a starting role imo (thought this last year also, but all we had was Sinc and I still preferred Liv.) I'd like to see Hina there with Janine on the RW if she's gonna continue to ball out going forward. Not trying to read too much into her short sub stint, though. Regardless, Hina should be the one on the field first of the three, and then let who you want on second dictate where you put Hina. Her versatility is a blessing and a curse...
I don’t think Liv is too inconsistent to start. If they decide that Beckie is more suited to start than Liv … then make the move. This is just a decision about who is the better player right now and Beckie is coming off her best game as a pro. Her tenure to date has been good speed, good crosses, and poor finishing, but the talent has always been there
The only thing I know for sure is that Hina starts. She’s effective regardless of where you put her on the pitch. I haven’t seen a definitive drop off at wing vs midfield. She knows how to use her talent in space.
Yup, nothing has changed from last year. Nothing will change. Starting Sinc is all the proof you need for that. And take KK with you. Some say give Norris a few more matches. Forget it. Lowden NOW.
do we actually know if Lowdon is a good coach? Her record is...fine? 4 wins, 4 losses, 3 draws in 2022, 2 wins and 2 losses in 2023, so 21 points from 15 games, with very subpar xG for and against in 2023.
Every improvement requires change; not every change is an improvement.
There's that.
I had not grasped the severity of the 2023 team's collapse, especially on the road, until the #s were laid out in yesterday's thread. Their early season success was like the continuing glide slope coming off the championship and then midseason, they lost momentum and stalled out. Now they're stuck in a field, nose down and need help. Who's making that happen?
Again, I want to be clear: I don’t think Norris is a very good coach. But I also really think that if you’re doing this one game into the season it’s highlighting that it was absurd to give him the entirety of pre-season.
What strikes me after the opening slate of games this weekend is how much the teams performed much as they were performing in 2023... with exception of Chicago. Houston underperformed their talent. NC arguably overperformed. Orlando and Loovull produced a tie, with Loovull coughing up a big lead and Orlando coming back. Portland and KC are again scoring goals and again leaking them. SD and Gotham look like top-of-table material.
I agree, I'd still want an actual global HC search rather than just hiring another assistant-to-interim HC-to-HC person with little actual HC experience...
Do it the right way and see what's available to the team now that the MP boat anchor is behind us. Maybe the Bhathals will spend Kang bucks and try to poach someone. Coaches who were hesitant before when things were quite uncertain may be more interested now. They have to be more ambitious if they "wanna be the best in the world"...no shade to Lowden there. I'd like to see how much better we can do....
Do you have any coaches on a wishlist who you think would be a good fit, culturally/stylistically?
Sarah Lowdon is the youngest female to ever receive that license and is one of the most respected coaches for her mind and knowledge. There aren't many coaches who are regarded in the highest standards like her. Whenever she decides to be a permanent head coach, Lowdon will be more than ready.
I don't doubt her qualifications or capabilities. That doesn't mean she'd be the Thorns savior in the event of Norris getting let go, and we shouldn't put that expectation on her. Manager performance is notoriously variable. Ready or not, she'd need time and Thorns fans shouldn't expect her to fix all the team's problems- That's unfair to her.
Of course those expectations are unfair to anyone. Sorry I may have missed a bunch of messages, not sure where these "savior" comments are coming from?
Yes, it's unfair to judge after first game in new season-
BUT-
I'm not wrong. He's shown himself over a year+ that he's in over his head, he inherited a championship calibre team and has been coasting them consistently downhill, he has a lineup of international-level talent playing head-scratchingly inept soccer- and has been for over a year- the clock is ticking on keeping superstars in the fold and developing young talented players.
He should be fired. Fair or no fair, nice guy or not. We'll chip in and get him a nice going away present. But he's not a coach capable of maximizing the potential of a world-class professional WoSo team, so what's the point of waiting?
"But who'll coach if he's gone?" Well, Lowdon is a very good interim choice sitting right there. Beyond that, I don't care- hell, I'm happy with kielbj manning the sidelines for awhile. Even if the new guy/gal isn't any better, it would send a refreshingly clear message from the new owners that they won't accept mediocrity (or whatever that was in KC) on their team.
I think a lot of people on this board are calling for Norris to be fired immediately and for Lowdon to come in and save the day lol. Just want to temper expectations a tad!
Somewhere last year someone (on this board?) provided a link to Lowden’s Pro License thesis presentation, where she analyzed Emma Hayes” lineups and tactics at Chelsea, explaining what made them work etc. it was impressive- though honestly way too on depth for me to follow without my eyes glazing over. But note: Lowden got her license after her interim stints at Houston, so she’s arguably a better tactical coach than she was then.
Cut to: the Thorns, where, unless there’s some ninja-level style they’re trying to play that only LOOKS like they don’t know WTF they’re doing… I think it’s safe to assume Norris is not as well-versed on coaching tactics (to adults, anyway).
It's one thing to analyze tactics, it's another thing to set up your own system of playing, and to coach it to players.
Here's the thing: she has some brief experience as interim but we'd be again giving the job to an assistant coach. It may or may not go well. But once you do that you have to either commit to giving the job to Lowdon OR you have to start the search for a new manager. I'm not sure what the Bhatals global knowledge is, but we already know what LeBlanc's is.
Yeah, that might be enough. But once you press that button it becomes harder to press it again from a process point of view.
And I think if as an ownership group you are trying to convince your star player to re-sign, as well as lifting the club from relative doldrums (again…they finished second last year lol) you have to have a good process.
That’s a good point- One nice thing about Lowden, though, is that she could take over as interim while the “process” takes place- giving PTFC an extra bite at the apple- if she delivers, great: If not, the new HC comes in and it was still just “one process.”
That's the problem from KC last year. It was pretty clear that Potter wasn't really the problem, as Sjöblom didn't do much better AND she spent the whole year campaigning for a job she was never going to get.
I really thought Norris has at last caught a freakin' clue about how to best use Hina Sugita at the end of last season, where he finally started playing her as a central playmaker. Then this bad joke of a roster decision. The only acceptable excuse for benching Sugita in favor of, well, ANY attacking player not named Sophia Smith would be an undisclosed knock. That's a possibility, given that Hina didn't play at all on her last Nadeshiko call-up and may not have been 90 minutes fit. Otherwise, it's an unacceptable spineless and/or mindless decision on the gaffer's part.
Moreover, the "defense" played like it had just met an hour before the match. In situations like that, at least some of the blame always falls on coaching.
Norris is off the hook for the third leg of this match's Trifecta of Terrible: Shelby Hogan's very, very bad day at the office. I expect better of her, and I'm sure she does, too.
From my perspective, they need to make a decision to only play Sinclair situationally and figure out whom you want to play more consistently between Hina, Beckie, and Moultrie. Hina is on the pitch automatically for me in that situation, but I think Norris has issues with her as a 10 for some weird reason
When she didn't play, even as a sub, on her last Nadeshiko call-up (with Jun Endo out, no less), I figured some sort of knock had to be the reason. No confirmation of that, one way or the other, but it _would_ explain an otherwise-inexplicable roster decision.
I’m almost certain of it. Plus Beckie probably had a minutes restriction as well, hence Sinclair starting. The weird thing is putting her wide - that ought to be someone else who has legs.
Also yeah, this is a bit of weird one for me. If she’s clearly better than Izzy, then I suppose it makes sense because we don’t have a true backup striker if they won’t play Izzy there…..but if she’s not clearly better (or is better, but not by a lot), she’s just taking minutes from the Izzys and Linnehans of the world.
We also don’t know who the backup striker is this season with no Betfort. Sinc played there in the preseason, so if Dias gets those minutes for this new summer tournament thing, I guess that’s a win? Veteran international talent is good too?
I don't specifically recall. But I ended up reading an article from a Portuguese journo (translated via google) and saw that she was at least tied to the Thorns back in Dec (among other Euro clubs.) She had also since left her club and hadn't been seen since.
She is pretty fast and has a physical profile. The Portuguese nats came an inch from knocking the US out in the group stage...the team was pretty good, and well-coached. She wasn't a part of the WC roster, but did get called up for the friendly matches against Czech Republic and South Korea on 21 and 24 February 2024 (according to Wikipedia.) She only has 4 caps though, and 0 goals....she's 26. So, another int'l bubble national teamer who you can't really draw a lot of data from (esp in the Russian league.) But, that's a bit safer to do for an attacking player (who you know will be a sub player), rather than for your whole defense imo, and we needed a viable backup 9. Still though, I imagine she's better than Izzy in game 1 just from pure skill and physical profile. Def better than Sinc. Lol. I imagine this will be the backup 9 and Izzy will end up being a utility forward....which, too bad, because she's really not anything but a true 9.
It def seems like they realized Izzy and Sinc wouldn't get it done if they're bringing in a 4th player who is a striker (but also they seem like they aren't quite sure about her either because the contract is only until the end of the season?)
Seems like they're getting several players on short contracts/loans to see who'll stick by the end of the season. It's kinda felt a bit like throwing everything at a wall to see what sticks. Next year this team will likely look very very different than it did last year. With Sinc gone, and potentially Kling and Becky, and then maybe even Sophia (sure hope not)...they're gonna have a lot of money free up (even if Soph stays.) I really hope they're already scouting for a new backline general CB (Summer would be nice, even) and will drop some real money for some tier 1 players.
Im not going to overreact too much to the Hogan game until we see her consistently performing poorly. I’m sure she was nervy after that first error on the road in a big occasion which led to shakiness after.
It's true. Having the backline she did definitely didn't help. I wasn't sold on her before this though, and this certainly didn't help. But you're right...kinda only way to go is up from here.
We also don’t know what they think of Kozal. She definitely has the athletic profile to be a starting keeper. I’m willing to be patient here, because up until this past week … I thought Hogan’s composure was one thing that looked like a positive
While obviously the game against KC was not a great showing for Hogan, remember that Bixby also had a similar abysmal day, so I'm willing to chalk it up to poor defensive coaching, and not Hogan's overall ability.
But Bixby also had an abysmal season. The one before wasn't great either. And honestly, there have been MANY new keepers come into the league in the past couple years and none of them had as many red flags as Hogan in even their first games. In fact, I would take most teams' #2 keepers over Hogan at this point (I said as much before the season ever started actually)...the coaching part you're right about, though.
I keep saying this, but our coach is not up to the task. We have a world-class team and not a world-class coach. Choosing a back line of essentially rookies? And hina on the bench and sinc starts? And on the wing at that? This is ridiculous.
The backline was like the third or fourth most egregious mistake Norris made. None of Kling, Reyes, or Becky are stopping any of the five KC goals from happening.
I thought was good to let the newbies have a run, since several are not so distant starters. Better to find out now which ones will rise then to try figure out during late season shield run
I have read all the negative comments and agreed with most, but as an optimist here is my take.
1. Janine Beckie looks better post knee injury than pre injury.
2. Soph will do what Soph does, pretty spectacular.
3. We saw what I think was probably Jessie Fleming's worst game as a Thorn, I think it will be great from here on folks, and she was much better in the second half.
4. The midfield looked much better in the second half and both Obaze and Muller opened their assist account.
5. The team fought back from looking like they were playing a player down in the first half, to a 5-4 loss and Janine and Soph were both a sitter away from a hat trick. Could have been a 6-5 win.
6. Yes Hogan had a bad game and we will see at the end of the week if she is shell shocked or can bounce back. I think she bounces back strong.
7. While I was not impressed with KC's inability to hold a big lead, like I said they could have easily lost that game, they do have some impressive players added to the mix. Zanaretto and Chawinga look super good and if Debinha recovers quickly, they will be a contender. They are not a bad team and possibly a really good one.
8. I really liked what I saw from Muller and Paine and I think we will see continued improvement from Obaze. But that is incumbent on Hubly and Sauerbrunn mentoring her and Hogan becoming more of a defensive general.
9. This 5-4 result is crazy, but I think that Crazy is going to be the word to describe the 2024 season. Hold on to your hats.
5. I was trying to keep my takes non-negative there, but you are right.
7. Yup, it is possible seeing the momentum change that Vlatco decided to take a chance losing while trying to win over the possibility of losing while trying not to lose.
Even though I thought the Thorns were the better team in the second half, Chawinga was causing all kinds of problems and will for every team they face. There are some fast players in the league; but she looks to be on a different plane.
Norris was suspect as a coach last year but I could chalk it up to non-stop organizational drama and change. However, this game picked up where the last one left off - disorganization on the back line, players assigned to the wrong position, etc. If he doesn’t figure it out, he’s a goner and should be.
A hilarious stat from the Expected Own Goals twitter: “ #BAONPDX backline + keeper had 199 #NWSL minutes combined over the last 12 months coming into this game.”
Sports fandom is fickle and I'm embarrassed (though only slightly!) to admit it, but that game straight up ruined this lovely Portland Saturday for me. Had so much frustrated energy afterwards I went on a second run of the day just so I could sweat out the bad vibes in Forest Park.
Honestly, taking Sinc off at halftime (the obvious correct decision) might have been the thing that triggered me the most. At least if he had left her on for 70 minutes, I could have just attributed it to obstinance. Like, yeah! No shit dumbass! You don't get points for fixing the easiest mistake to rectify after your team shipped three goals! Everyone and their mother could have told you starting Sinc at RW --against known attacking threat Hailie Mace and in front of a rookie, no less-- was the worst lineup decision you can possibly make! He *recognized* how stupid it was and made a halftime substitution! WHY DID HE NEED 45 MINUTES? It's like he went "ahh, my bad, who coulda seen that coming, but at least I fixed it!" He sees these players every day and STILL started her! Legit coaching terrorism!
There are obviously other issues, but every team has some of those. Hogan looked identical to Bixby last season and was directly responsible for two goals. Weaver, Fleming, Muller, Coffey, and Moultrie were all subpar relative to expectation. Norris' tactics suck. Starting three NWSL first timers in an occasion like this one probably wasn't the best decision, but I can live with that choice. But NOTHING makes me more frustrated than coaches getting the *easiest* decisions wrong, and continuing to play Sinc is so damn incompetent it's mind numbing. This team might have *legitimately won the game* despite everything -- and again, I acknowledge there are plenty of other issues at play, including other aspects of Norris' coaching-- if they hadn't been playing 10 vs. 11 for a half. The fact that the dude looks like a confused lizard on the sidelines 90% of the time and can barely put together a coherent sentence in a presser doesn't make me feel any better.
(Rant over- On a positive note, I'm very happy for Janine. Great performance by her. This is still a fun roster of players to root for and I'm excited for the home opener next week!)
Seems to have broken through the barricade separating soccer fans [subset B, women's soccer] from other sportsball fans and even leaking into the general public's sphere of awareness.
Could ironically work in our favor retaining her playing pro in the States, especially if endorsement income exceeds her player salary. Becoming a hired terrorist for PSG does not help her endorse Subway or Mastercard back home.
Yes, I've had coffee this a.m., thanks for asking.
Two full trainings before the KC game is crazyyyy. Norris-related stuff aside, I'm sure that played a large role in the extent of the disconnect on Saturday.
- She seems excited for the season!
- Certainly not gonna be because of the fans or teammates if she chooses to leave; never misses an opportunity to praise both.
- Her response to the Vlatko question was funny. "He's a great guy and I'm happy for him!"
(She's also apparently taking a little mid-week beach vacation with her BF lol)
I saw the little vacay too and was like ??? (girl you need to be practicing with your team bc…THAT lol.) But, after the Gold Cup final, she also went to AZ to hang with her bf even though we had a game 5 days later in KC lol. Can’t complain though, she did do her job. Maybe that leniency is part of a deal to keep her happily in Portland…that’s what I’ve been telling myself lol
I worry more about a Denver or Phoenix team coming into the league than Europe. I see her as way more attached to family and boyfriend than the pull of playing for a Euro team. The endorsement income she could earn here I think could exceed her player salary. The only benefit of playing in Europe I think is more votes for Balon de Oro. Playing for Euro teams didn't work out that well for Christen Press or Rose LaVelle. And even Sam Kerr shreading records at Chelsea has not got her the cup she wants.
Sophia is so likeable and photogenic she will do well here. Management: Get a grass training field!
Thanks for that. Will ACFC really be that bad? It seemed like they played pretty well last year once Becki Tweed took over. Their post-Tweed PPG was enough to move them above the playoff line, and if they keep up that PPG for an entire season, they'll finish as one of the better teams in the league. It's true that the front-office turmoil might affect them, but it might well not; the Thorns have often done well in spite of their (more massive) FO issues.
No, I think they'll actually be pretty good (honestly, teams 3-12 are all pretty interchangeable for me, but I had to rank them somehow!). I think I noted it at the end of their section, but I bet they'll be right in amongst the playoff battle with about eight other teams. One of the things I was skeptical about was how they would replace McKaskill and Camberos, but their newest teenager Fuller was *awesome* last night.
I don't really have the time to watch every NWSL match every week, so I'm planning to keep my weekly recap column to four games per matchweek. Anyone have any preferences as far as which games I cover this week?
I'm gonna say the BFC game because of their new splashy signings and because they've obviously not played any games yet. Their coach has said they wanna be the "west coast Barcelona" lol, so I'm curious how that looks (and if Kundananji plays.)
Also, Reign v Spirit (a Trin-less Spirit I might add- lucky for Seattle) because each team has interesting storylines. Spirit with Giraldez' newly appointed coach no doubt playing them in the style he'll arrive to, and Reign because their offseason was a mess and I'm just curious how it all works. I'm thinking LH sets them up in a new formation...
(You can just skip the Thorns game if you wanna avoid retraumatizing yourself.)
I would like NC vs Houston. I think Jane Campbell is great goal keeper, what the hell happened? I think the Orlando Louiville game would be interesting as you really were showing some surprising Orlando love preseason. Are they both bad or both good?
Janine Beastie after today. Great to say, great to see!
Having that game, coming off a career-threatening injury and year of rehab? Thrilled for her and happy for the team. Now, figure how to best fit her in.
This is the question I am facing because when she is fully fit for 90 minutes, going to be hard to take her off the pitch. When healthy, she is a crossing and passing wizard. I think Hina starting and Janine finishing games would be a good start. However, if JB plays like we all know she can, she'll be a full-time starter in months or even weeks.
Another option is that Norris finally moves Hina to the 10, AND Beckie starts on the RW.
Sorry to say, but Liv is the player who kinda performed the least yesterday and is generally the more inconsistent player overall between her and Hina. If Beckie is gonna make noise on the RW and score goals and make Norris have to include her, then the positional battle returns to the 10. Who is performing better, Hina or Moultrie? At this point I'd def still go with Hina. Positional battles are GOOD though. We need this all over the field.
However, I DO think it'll be a while before Janine is 90 mins fit, so for now I think Hina will be sharing the RW with her. If Beckie continues to be a beast, I'd rather start with Hina at the 10 and Janine at RW. Then at half, if Janine has to come out, move Hina up to RW and bring in Liv at the 10.
Clearly Hina (which is not shade on Liv...it's just the way it is). But Norris seems to have a huge blind spot about Hina at the 10.
Liv is just too inconsistent for a starting role imo (thought this last year also, but all we had was Sinc and I still preferred Liv.) I'd like to see Hina there with Janine on the RW if she's gonna continue to ball out going forward. Not trying to read too much into her short sub stint, though. Regardless, Hina should be the one on the field first of the three, and then let who you want on second dictate where you put Hina. Her versatility is a blessing and a curse...
Thought Liv made good use of her Gold Cup field time FWIW, perhaps Kilgore has a better notion of how to use her.
I don’t think Liv is too inconsistent to start. If they decide that Beckie is more suited to start than Liv … then make the move. This is just a decision about who is the better player right now and Beckie is coming off her best game as a pro. Her tenure to date has been good speed, good crosses, and poor finishing, but the talent has always been there
The only thing I know for sure is that Hina starts. She’s effective regardless of where you put her on the pitch. I haven’t seen a definitive drop off at wing vs midfield. She knows how to use her talent in space.
#NORRISOUT
Lowden is right there
Yup, nothing has changed from last year. Nothing will change. Starting Sinc is all the proof you need for that. And take KK with you. Some say give Norris a few more matches. Forget it. Lowden NOW.
Devil's advocate:
do we actually know if Lowdon is a good coach? Her record is...fine? 4 wins, 4 losses, 3 draws in 2022, 2 wins and 2 losses in 2023, so 21 points from 15 games, with very subpar xG for and against in 2023.
Every improvement requires change; not every change is an improvement.
There's that.
I had not grasped the severity of the 2023 team's collapse, especially on the road, until the #s were laid out in yesterday's thread. Their early season success was like the continuing glide slope coming off the championship and then midseason, they lost momentum and stalled out. Now they're stuck in a field, nose down and need help. Who's making that happen?
My only thing is I do think we need to give it some time and separation from last season because we have basically a brand new defence.
We also have the luxury of time because 8 of 14 teams make the playoffs in this league.
Yeah, I agree with the top line there.
Again, I want to be clear: I don’t think Norris is a very good coach. But I also really think that if you’re doing this one game into the season it’s highlighting that it was absurd to give him the entirety of pre-season.
What strikes me after the opening slate of games this weekend is how much the teams performed much as they were performing in 2023... with exception of Chicago. Houston underperformed their talent. NC arguably overperformed. Orlando and Loovull produced a tie, with Loovull coughing up a big lead and Orlando coming back. Portland and KC are again scoring goals and again leaking them. SD and Gotham look like top-of-table material.
I agree, I'd still want an actual global HC search rather than just hiring another assistant-to-interim HC-to-HC person with little actual HC experience...
Do it the right way and see what's available to the team now that the MP boat anchor is behind us. Maybe the Bhathals will spend Kang bucks and try to poach someone. Coaches who were hesitant before when things were quite uncertain may be more interested now. They have to be more ambitious if they "wanna be the best in the world"...no shade to Lowden there. I'd like to see how much better we can do....
Do you have any coaches on a wishlist who you think would be a good fit, culturally/stylistically?
Yeah I think Lowdon might make things a little more stable but I’m not sure where the idea that she’s some stud manager comes from lol
On the other hand, "a little more stable" probably makes a world of difference with this team.
Sarah Lowdon is the youngest female to ever receive that license and is one of the most respected coaches for her mind and knowledge. There aren't many coaches who are regarded in the highest standards like her. Whenever she decides to be a permanent head coach, Lowdon will be more than ready.
I don't doubt her qualifications or capabilities. That doesn't mean she'd be the Thorns savior in the event of Norris getting let go, and we shouldn't put that expectation on her. Manager performance is notoriously variable. Ready or not, she'd need time and Thorns fans shouldn't expect her to fix all the team's problems- That's unfair to her.
Of course those expectations are unfair to anyone. Sorry I may have missed a bunch of messages, not sure where these "savior" comments are coming from?
It's me, it's coming from me!
Yes, Norris seems like a good guy-
Yes, it's too early-
Yes, it's unfair to judge after first game in new season-
BUT-
I'm not wrong. He's shown himself over a year+ that he's in over his head, he inherited a championship calibre team and has been coasting them consistently downhill, he has a lineup of international-level talent playing head-scratchingly inept soccer- and has been for over a year- the clock is ticking on keeping superstars in the fold and developing young talented players.
He should be fired. Fair or no fair, nice guy or not. We'll chip in and get him a nice going away present. But he's not a coach capable of maximizing the potential of a world-class professional WoSo team, so what's the point of waiting?
"But who'll coach if he's gone?" Well, Lowdon is a very good interim choice sitting right there. Beyond that, I don't care- hell, I'm happy with kielbj manning the sidelines for awhile. Even if the new guy/gal isn't any better, it would send a refreshingly clear message from the new owners that they won't accept mediocrity (or whatever that was in KC) on their team.
I think a lot of people on this board are calling for Norris to be fired immediately and for Lowdon to come in and save the day lol. Just want to temper expectations a tad!
Somewhere last year someone (on this board?) provided a link to Lowden’s Pro License thesis presentation, where she analyzed Emma Hayes” lineups and tactics at Chelsea, explaining what made them work etc. it was impressive- though honestly way too on depth for me to follow without my eyes glazing over. But note: Lowden got her license after her interim stints at Houston, so she’s arguably a better tactical coach than she was then.
Cut to: the Thorns, where, unless there’s some ninja-level style they’re trying to play that only LOOKS like they don’t know WTF they’re doing… I think it’s safe to assume Norris is not as well-versed on coaching tactics (to adults, anyway).
It's one thing to analyze tactics, it's another thing to set up your own system of playing, and to coach it to players.
Here's the thing: she has some brief experience as interim but we'd be again giving the job to an assistant coach. It may or may not go well. But once you do that you have to either commit to giving the job to Lowdon OR you have to start the search for a new manager. I'm not sure what the Bhatals global knowledge is, but we already know what LeBlanc's is.
Personally think this is more anti Norris than pro Lowdon.
Craig's List ad here: "Would you like to coach the world's best striker?" but has a 503 area code, not 916.
Lowden turned down the Houston HC job, saying she wanted to wait unt she got her license and was ready. I wonder if she’d be ready by Apriil?
Yeah, that might be enough. But once you press that button it becomes harder to press it again from a process point of view.
And I think if as an ownership group you are trying to convince your star player to re-sign, as well as lifting the club from relative doldrums (again…they finished second last year lol) you have to have a good process.
That’s a good point- One nice thing about Lowden, though, is that she could take over as interim while the “process” takes place- giving PTFC an extra bite at the apple- if she delivers, great: If not, the new HC comes in and it was still just “one process.”
That's the problem from KC last year. It was pretty clear that Potter wasn't really the problem, as Sjöblom didn't do much better AND she spent the whole year campaigning for a job she was never going to get.
I really thought Norris has at last caught a freakin' clue about how to best use Hina Sugita at the end of last season, where he finally started playing her as a central playmaker. Then this bad joke of a roster decision. The only acceptable excuse for benching Sugita in favor of, well, ANY attacking player not named Sophia Smith would be an undisclosed knock. That's a possibility, given that Hina didn't play at all on her last Nadeshiko call-up and may not have been 90 minutes fit. Otherwise, it's an unacceptable spineless and/or mindless decision on the gaffer's part.
Moreover, the "defense" played like it had just met an hour before the match. In situations like that, at least some of the blame always falls on coaching.
Norris is off the hook for the third leg of this match's Trifecta of Terrible: Shelby Hogan's very, very bad day at the office. I expect better of her, and I'm sure she does, too.
Am I in the #NorrisOut camp? Yeah...I think I am.
Hina is amazing and I don’t understand any coaching decision that keeps her off the field…
From my perspective, they need to make a decision to only play Sinclair situationally and figure out whom you want to play more consistently between Hina, Beckie, and Moultrie. Hina is on the pitch automatically for me in that situation, but I think Norris has issues with her as a 10 for some weird reason
she be in only to provide rest when game is mostly out of reach
It's quite possible she's not fully fit. She didn't look fully herself when she was playing.
Seems unlikely but maybe? She’s only like 28, so I’d struggle to see what Sinclair plays and she doesn’t.
Hina just turned 27 a month or so ago.
It’s not that she’s unfit in general, just carrying a knock. As David pointed out she got limited minutes for Japan too
When she didn't play, even as a sub, on her last Nadeshiko call-up (with Jun Endo out, no less), I figured some sort of knock had to be the reason. No confirmation of that, one way or the other, but it _would_ explain an otherwise-inexplicable roster decision.
I’m almost certain of it. Plus Beckie probably had a minutes restriction as well, hence Sinclair starting. The weird thing is putting her wide - that ought to be someone else who has legs.
Phrase you love to hear: "Elizabeth Ball defending Sophia Smith." [brace goal clip]
Someone give me a badge already:
"INBOX: Portland Thorns FC have acquired Portugal National Team forward Ana Dias for the 2024 season.
#BAONPDX"
Weird that it's only for a season. But also, WHY do they keep signing anyone but experienced defenders and/or GK's lol.
I forget how did you figure this one out?
Also yeah, this is a bit of weird one for me. If she’s clearly better than Izzy, then I suppose it makes sense because we don’t have a true backup striker if they won’t play Izzy there…..but if she’s not clearly better (or is better, but not by a lot), she’s just taking minutes from the Izzys and Linnehans of the world.
We also don’t know who the backup striker is this season with no Betfort. Sinc played there in the preseason, so if Dias gets those minutes for this new summer tournament thing, I guess that’s a win? Veteran international talent is good too?
I don't specifically recall. But I ended up reading an article from a Portuguese journo (translated via google) and saw that she was at least tied to the Thorns back in Dec (among other Euro clubs.) She had also since left her club and hadn't been seen since.
She is pretty fast and has a physical profile. The Portuguese nats came an inch from knocking the US out in the group stage...the team was pretty good, and well-coached. She wasn't a part of the WC roster, but did get called up for the friendly matches against Czech Republic and South Korea on 21 and 24 February 2024 (according to Wikipedia.) She only has 4 caps though, and 0 goals....she's 26. So, another int'l bubble national teamer who you can't really draw a lot of data from (esp in the Russian league.) But, that's a bit safer to do for an attacking player (who you know will be a sub player), rather than for your whole defense imo, and we needed a viable backup 9. Still though, I imagine she's better than Izzy in game 1 just from pure skill and physical profile. Def better than Sinc. Lol. I imagine this will be the backup 9 and Izzy will end up being a utility forward....which, too bad, because she's really not anything but a true 9.
Here's her highlights from last year: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gXU24kdfH4&t=3s
My hopeful side is that maybe they’ll realize they can’t play Sinclair against most teams and they needed better forward depth.
It def seems like they realized Izzy and Sinc wouldn't get it done if they're bringing in a 4th player who is a striker (but also they seem like they aren't quite sure about her either because the contract is only until the end of the season?)
Seems like they're getting several players on short contracts/loans to see who'll stick by the end of the season. It's kinda felt a bit like throwing everything at a wall to see what sticks. Next year this team will likely look very very different than it did last year. With Sinc gone, and potentially Kling and Becky, and then maybe even Sophia (sure hope not)...they're gonna have a lot of money free up (even if Soph stays.) I really hope they're already scouting for a new backline general CB (Summer would be nice, even) and will drop some real money for some tier 1 players.
Maybe working toward a 0-5-5 formation?
Can she play GK or CB also is what I wanna know lol
Im not going to overreact too much to the Hogan game until we see her consistently performing poorly. I’m sure she was nervy after that first error on the road in a big occasion which led to shakiness after.
It's true. Having the backline she did definitely didn't help. I wasn't sold on her before this though, and this certainly didn't help. But you're right...kinda only way to go is up from here.
We also don’t know what they think of Kozal. She definitely has the athletic profile to be a starting keeper. I’m willing to be patient here, because up until this past week … I thought Hogan’s composure was one thing that looked like a positive
While obviously the game against KC was not a great showing for Hogan, remember that Bixby also had a similar abysmal day, so I'm willing to chalk it up to poor defensive coaching, and not Hogan's overall ability.
But Bixby also had an abysmal season. The one before wasn't great either. And honestly, there have been MANY new keepers come into the league in the past couple years and none of them had as many red flags as Hogan in even their first games. In fact, I would take most teams' #2 keepers over Hogan at this point (I said as much before the season ever started actually)...the coaching part you're right about, though.
Fair, which is truly ironic considering our GM and coach...
I know it's been said multiple times, but I'm so happy for Janine Beckie. You could see her hard work pay off, and it's so satisfying.
I keep saying this, but our coach is not up to the task. We have a world-class team and not a world-class coach. Choosing a back line of essentially rookies? And hina on the bench and sinc starts? And on the wing at that? This is ridiculous.
The backline was like the third or fourth most egregious mistake Norris made. None of Kling, Reyes, or Becky are stopping any of the five KC goals from happening.
I thought was good to let the newbies have a run, since several are not so distant starters. Better to find out now which ones will rise then to try figure out during late season shield run
who would you start in defence instead
I have read all the negative comments and agreed with most, but as an optimist here is my take.
1. Janine Beckie looks better post knee injury than pre injury.
2. Soph will do what Soph does, pretty spectacular.
3. We saw what I think was probably Jessie Fleming's worst game as a Thorn, I think it will be great from here on folks, and she was much better in the second half.
4. The midfield looked much better in the second half and both Obaze and Muller opened their assist account.
5. The team fought back from looking like they were playing a player down in the first half, to a 5-4 loss and Janine and Soph were both a sitter away from a hat trick. Could have been a 6-5 win.
6. Yes Hogan had a bad game and we will see at the end of the week if she is shell shocked or can bounce back. I think she bounces back strong.
7. While I was not impressed with KC's inability to hold a big lead, like I said they could have easily lost that game, they do have some impressive players added to the mix. Zanaretto and Chawinga look super good and if Debinha recovers quickly, they will be a contender. They are not a bad team and possibly a really good one.
8. I really liked what I saw from Muller and Paine and I think we will see continued improvement from Obaze. But that is incumbent on Hubly and Sauerbrunn mentoring her and Hogan becoming more of a defensive general.
9. This 5-4 result is crazy, but I think that Crazy is going to be the word to describe the 2024 season. Hold on to your hats.
Müller, I found out how to do it! Much easier on the IPhone.
5) It seemed to me the Thorns *were* a player down in the first half.
7) TBF, KC weren't trying to hold a big lead, they were trying to make it even bigger.
5. I was trying to keep my takes non-negative there, but you are right.
7. Yup, it is possible seeing the momentum change that Vlatco decided to take a chance losing while trying to win over the possibility of losing while trying not to lose.
Even though I thought the Thorns were the better team in the second half, Chawinga was causing all kinds of problems and will for every team they face. There are some fast players in the league; but she looks to be on a different plane.
Norris was suspect as a coach last year but I could chalk it up to non-stop organizational drama and change. However, this game picked up where the last one left off - disorganization on the back line, players assigned to the wrong position, etc. If he doesn’t figure it out, he’s a goner and should be.
A hilarious stat from the Expected Own Goals twitter: “ #BAONPDX backline + keeper had 199 #NWSL minutes combined over the last 12 months coming into this game.”
Might be true if you exclude Kelli "Ironwoman" Hubly!
I think that’s what they meant! Basically, the combined amount of time Hubly and Hogan have played together is only 199 minutes. The rest…0!
Starting Sinc as a winger is delusional. WTF.
Sports fandom is fickle and I'm embarrassed (though only slightly!) to admit it, but that game straight up ruined this lovely Portland Saturday for me. Had so much frustrated energy afterwards I went on a second run of the day just so I could sweat out the bad vibes in Forest Park.
Honestly, taking Sinc off at halftime (the obvious correct decision) might have been the thing that triggered me the most. At least if he had left her on for 70 minutes, I could have just attributed it to obstinance. Like, yeah! No shit dumbass! You don't get points for fixing the easiest mistake to rectify after your team shipped three goals! Everyone and their mother could have told you starting Sinc at RW --against known attacking threat Hailie Mace and in front of a rookie, no less-- was the worst lineup decision you can possibly make! He *recognized* how stupid it was and made a halftime substitution! WHY DID HE NEED 45 MINUTES? It's like he went "ahh, my bad, who coulda seen that coming, but at least I fixed it!" He sees these players every day and STILL started her! Legit coaching terrorism!
There are obviously other issues, but every team has some of those. Hogan looked identical to Bixby last season and was directly responsible for two goals. Weaver, Fleming, Muller, Coffey, and Moultrie were all subpar relative to expectation. Norris' tactics suck. Starting three NWSL first timers in an occasion like this one probably wasn't the best decision, but I can live with that choice. But NOTHING makes me more frustrated than coaches getting the *easiest* decisions wrong, and continuing to play Sinc is so damn incompetent it's mind numbing. This team might have *legitimately won the game* despite everything -- and again, I acknowledge there are plenty of other issues at play, including other aspects of Norris' coaching-- if they hadn't been playing 10 vs. 11 for a half. The fact that the dude looks like a confused lizard on the sidelines 90% of the time and can barely put together a coherent sentence in a presser doesn't make me feel any better.
(Rant over- On a positive note, I'm very happy for Janine. Great performance by her. This is still a fun roster of players to root for and I'm excited for the home opener next week!)
Sophia Smith is all over the ESPN+ event is in process breaks. Love seeing her in a Thorns uniform
Seems to have broken through the barricade separating soccer fans [subset B, women's soccer] from other sportsball fans and even leaking into the general public's sphere of awareness.
Could ironically work in our favor retaining her playing pro in the States, especially if endorsement income exceeds her player salary. Becoming a hired terrorist for PSG does not help her endorse Subway or Mastercard back home.
Yes, I've had coffee this a.m., thanks for asking.
Not sure if anyone saw this interview with Soph on Futbol Americas just before the KC game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0WsaekP4L0&t=11s
Two full trainings before the KC game is crazyyyy. Norris-related stuff aside, I'm sure that played a large role in the extent of the disconnect on Saturday.
- She seems excited for the season!
- Certainly not gonna be because of the fans or teammates if she chooses to leave; never misses an opportunity to praise both.
- Her response to the Vlatko question was funny. "He's a great guy and I'm happy for him!"
(She's also apparently taking a little mid-week beach vacation with her BF lol)
I saw the little vacay too and was like ??? (girl you need to be practicing with your team bc…THAT lol.) But, after the Gold Cup final, she also went to AZ to hang with her bf even though we had a game 5 days later in KC lol. Can’t complain though, she did do her job. Maybe that leniency is part of a deal to keep her happily in Portland…that’s what I’ve been telling myself lol
Yes had the same thought- Go enjoy hanging with your partner, we know you'll do your thing regardless.
I worry more about a Denver or Phoenix team coming into the league than Europe. I see her as way more attached to family and boyfriend than the pull of playing for a Euro team. The endorsement income she could earn here I think could exceed her player salary. The only benefit of playing in Europe I think is more votes for Balon de Oro. Playing for Euro teams didn't work out that well for Christen Press or Rose LaVelle. And even Sam Kerr shreading records at Chelsea has not got her the cup she wants.
Sophia is so likeable and photogenic she will do well here. Management: Get a grass training field!
Yeah, it made me a little hopeful with all those nice words. I just hope she stays a Thorn beyond this season.
https://www.theeaststandnwsl.com/post/nwsl-2024-season-preview-part-iii-spoon-contenders
Final third of the season preview- The Spoon contenders!
(took a lot longer than I expected to do the full 14 lol)
Thanks for that. Will ACFC really be that bad? It seemed like they played pretty well last year once Becki Tweed took over. Their post-Tweed PPG was enough to move them above the playoff line, and if they keep up that PPG for an entire season, they'll finish as one of the better teams in the league. It's true that the front-office turmoil might affect them, but it might well not; the Thorns have often done well in spite of their (more massive) FO issues.
No, I think they'll actually be pretty good (honestly, teams 3-12 are all pretty interchangeable for me, but I had to rank them somehow!). I think I noted it at the end of their section, but I bet they'll be right in amongst the playoff battle with about eight other teams. One of the things I was skeptical about was how they would replace McKaskill and Camberos, but their newest teenager Fuller was *awesome* last night.
I don't really have the time to watch every NWSL match every week, so I'm planning to keep my weekly recap column to four games per matchweek. Anyone have any preferences as far as which games I cover this week?
I'm gonna say the BFC game because of their new splashy signings and because they've obviously not played any games yet. Their coach has said they wanna be the "west coast Barcelona" lol, so I'm curious how that looks (and if Kundananji plays.)
Also, Reign v Spirit (a Trin-less Spirit I might add- lucky for Seattle) because each team has interesting storylines. Spirit with Giraldez' newly appointed coach no doubt playing them in the style he'll arrive to, and Reign because their offseason was a mess and I'm just curious how it all works. I'm thinking LH sets them up in a new formation...
(You can just skip the Thorns game if you wanna avoid retraumatizing yourself.)
I would like NC vs Houston. I think Jane Campbell is great goal keeper, what the hell happened? I think the Orlando Louiville game would be interesting as you really were showing some surprising Orlando love preseason. Are they both bad or both good?