I'll have everybody know that I quite literally almost ran into Hina Sugita at the PSU farmer's market this morning and was incredibly awkward bc I have no idea how much english she understands, but I told her congrats on the award and gl in playoffs! But she was just as smiley and sweet as you'd expect!
Oh, and here’s just the perfectly adorable Hina-Sincy moment. At Sinc’s post match presser she takes a question (from someone we can’t see) but it’s Sugita-senshu. In this very hesitant tone she asks “Who will you miss the most…” at which there’s some crosstalk before Hina-san adds in an ever smaller voice “…and why is it me?”
I died from Utter Sweetness Overload.
FWIW the answer is that Sinc just thinks Hina-san is the Best Nicest locker buddy she’s ever had.
If you’re searching the Q&A comes at about 18:30 on the YouTube recording.
I think she might understand quite a bit but be reticent to speak if she feels self-conscious about her proficiency (e.g. I have a tiny smattering of Japanese from my kendo, but my accent is atrocious so I prefer to accompany a bow with “good morning” rather than “ohaio gomazu”.). So she probably understood your good wishes even if she didn’t answer directly…
But yes, even if Hina-senshu has amassed a decent amount of English, she might be self-conscious about using it in front of native speakers she's not friends with. I'm still like that, absolutely convinced I'll screw up even on stuff I know pretty well.
See? Like I said; I suck at basic Japanese even after years of being immersed in one of the most Japanese martial arts evah. So I totally get the reticence.
I can sing twinkle twinkle little star in Japanese and that's about it lol. A strange vestige of a young brain because a childhood best friend grew up in Okinawa.
But yes, I know she has likely picked up decent understanding the past few years.....but I do remember Rhian saying she knew 0 English when she came. I tried to keep it short, mostly because I just didn't wanna be weird lol.
Hina has been around here long enough to be fluent in English. There is a lot of down time for players that would give her the opportunity to take ESL classes. Then there's the fact that, unlike the United States, most countries in the world have learning teaching a second language as part of regular school.
Absolutely true. But take it from someone who lives in Japan: Japanese schools' English teaching is shockingly bad for the most part, geared towards passing a basic exam (and promptly forgetting almost everything...). Especially away from "attractors" (places where the tourist industry draws English speakers) like Kyoto or the more central parts of Tokyo, the large majority of Japanese people have only a smattering of English phrases in their vocabulary.
Moreover, English is _hard_ for Japanese speakers (and vice-versa: I'm working hard for very modest progress in Japanese language school, and that's only partly down to me being "chotto baka"...a bit of an idiot). The very different grammatical structure, English's notorious inconsistencies, a new character set (albeit a simple one compared to Japanese's more-complex three), and pronunciation challenges make it difficult. The only advantage is that of Japanese's tons of "borrow words" imported from other languages, the large majority are from English; this kind of "preloads" their vocabulary of English words.
Okay, lots of rambling to just point out that while Hina has certainly learned some English, she may not necessarily be all that fluent.
I took a couple community college "adult learning" classes in Japanese several years ago. Yep. It is way different than English. Then it occurred to me that I never learn to read or write...so I switched to French.
I lived in Yokohama for 3 years in the mid 60’s (Navy brat) and had a fair amount of contact with Japanese nationals and I picked up only a handful of common phrases. Tough language to learn for sure.
You can see a bit of bruising still, but I was def not paying attention mostly because I am socially awkward lol. She had flowers and a coffee and was just standing there taking it all in. I think a lot of players go to this farmer's market....I've seen pics from multiple players being here!
Maybe Hina was waiting for her but I didn't see her. Tbf the PSU farmer's market is absolutely bumpin' and I kinda got tunnel vision when I saw Hina lol, and then I ran away quickly because I am weird.
Whatever your politics, I hope you will all join me in a strengthened determination to protect the rights of marginalized people. We need to stand up together for our beliefs.
Do we think that, at this point, a lack of any sort of word from Kling and Sauerbrunn indicates that they both plan to return next year? Sinc may be THE goat, but Kling and Sauerbrunn are also even-toed ungulates who deserve a proper fan send-off.
You know what, I've been thinking about it, and I do think there is a possibility that was Kling's last game. I thought it was interesting last night that it was her who subbed in for Sinc (even though I think she was on the IR for a possible calf injury.) The Riveters also held up a Kling jersey when she came on (maybe they know something...) But I've been seeing a lot of pictures posted from last night and I see Kling really losing it in a lot of them. Craig Mitchelldyer (former Thorns photog) posted several on IG and there's a really sweet one of Becky comforting her. It was during the rose ceremony, in particular when the team was holding hands/swinging arms and there's pictures where she's just losin' it. It reminded me of seeing Horan looking distraught on her last walk-around at PP after we lost to Chicago in the playoffs...and then soon after we found out she was leaving. With Kling, it made me wonder if she knows that was maybe her last game as well. I sure hope not. I hope she gives supporters a chance to celebrate her as well...
Yeah I just went and looked. She did say she had no inside knowledge or anything, just that her contract hasn’t been renewed…
Becky’s contract hasn’t been renewed yet either but I can’t imagine she’s retiring…nor could I imagine not re-signing her if she still wants to play. That would be actually insane.
There are still a ton of players who are out of contract at the end of the season: Kling, Becky, Bella, Hubly, Provenzano, Asman, Hirst, McKenzie, Sheva, Kozal. I do imagine we part ways with some or many of these but not all of ‘em. I imagine KK should still be doing a lot of this work now, until the end of the season when she’s out. Otherwise, the new GM is gonna have a hell of an off-season to get through. Tons of new contracts, lots of dead weight, a retirement, and definite need to upgrade the roster with several elite players needed, as well as good depth. Hopefully Karina is making that job a little easier by doing some of the re-signing/housekeeping work now!
My guess is that this offseason is going to be pretty chaotic. Unless the squad runs the playoff table I have to think it’s getting a new gaffer. We know they’re getting a new GM. I’m guessing there’s already some roster moves planned.
So I’ll bet there’s going to be more than the usual interval w no signings news. FO might do handshake deals rather than commit new GM/HC to contracts they might want to negate before next season..?
So I might not want to read TOO much into the immediate lack of renewals/offers. Could be something…but also might not.
A couple of years ago Sauerbrunn said that as long as a team will have her, she'll play.
It is my wish that Kling would retire of her own accord. Were it me, if I once was a regular starter when the day came that I wasn't, that is when I would retire. Kling has won every championship that is available (World Cup, NWSL, I don't recall if Olympic gold is another).
Personally, I get a sense of satisfaction when a player goes out on their own terms.
This is why I feel conflicted about Sinclair. Going out after the 2022 NWSL Championship Championship would have been perfect.
I don't think Kling has an Olympic gold medal. She wasn't on this year's team, and the previous time we won, in 2012, she was an alternate. I don't think alternates get a medal unless they make the bench (or the field) at least once, and I don't think Kling did.
So…I tend to agree on Kling. Big, big part of the 2016-17 run, team huddle ranter, overall (as Sinc emphasized) “team spirit animal”. She deserves her own “send-off night” similar to what Sinc got.
Brunn? Sorta. She seems like terrific people and does deserve a salute when she hangs ‘em up.
But she’s played many more games - and bigger games - for the Kroyals in whatever form they took, FCKC or Utah, than she has for us. I’m not sure how she sees herself. But I still remember the goddamn goal she scored against us for Utah. I just can’t see her the same way I see Kling, or Sinc.
Great player? Ohhellyes. Great “Portland” player? I’d say “kinda”.
I understand this line of thinking with Sauerbrunn, but I would love to give her the benefit of the doubt of being a leader and stabilizing force on this team (and with the players union) while we were going through our mess.
Maybe it's because I'm a more recent Thorns fan but hard, hard disagree about Becky. Listening to her on Sam Mewis's podcast, among other things, she's such a hard care Thornie and Portlander. She deserves ALL of her flowers when she hangs up her boots.
Super, SUPER bummed to have had to miss that one live, but seemed like an awesome occasion and obviously an important result.
Gonna be real brave here and make it known that I think having Soph, Weaver, and Hina in the same lineup is pretty important! This is not a defense of Gale who has done the opposite of elevating the talent he's had available, but sometimes it can be as simple as "having your best players on the field = good." Not that anyone should have needed reminding, but Sophia Smith is really, really, REALLY damn good and her presence alone frees things up for everyone else.
Speaking of Soph Pt. 1: She's right. Angles are often deceiving, but I don't think this could be any more obvious. I don't blame her for rage-tweeting at 7 AM the morning after a 3-0 win. https://x.com/sophsssmith/status/1852713310476779590
Super bummed to miss that as well. I had a ticket, but I also had the worst instance of insomnia I've had in decades and it ruined my whole day.
Many, many thanks for both links. That offsides call is galling, and all the more so w/ VAR at their disposal.
And I was really hoping someone would link that interview clip. As impressed as I am by her play (and I think she's already the most dominant pro athlete in the city's history), it's her thoughtful, genuine and enormously good-hearted nature that makes it all the more thrilling to follow her career at this close vantage.
agreed having soph on field freestyle things up immensely. However this is one of hale's biggest failures he has no idea how to get those freedom up players involved there is plan.
The offside call was a whole lot closer than that Xeet makes it appear - there's really deceptive perspective going on there - but I measured with lines in a freeze-frame and it still looked like she was onside. But only by inches, and if I was slightly wrong in either timing or measuring, she could have been off. Still think she was on though.
I forget where I saw it, but someone did actual photogrammetry lines for this one and it was pretty clearly onside even if it that particular angle is a little deceptive. Like, very easily a clear and obvious error. Hell, even the back angle that they showed during the broadcast (which is more biased the other way) makes her look onside.
The biggest problem is that they have overturned other (much tighter) offside calls using the same angles. If they’re not going to use the tech, they have to be consistent with how they apply the clear and obvious metric.
I love his Wonka; it’s so dangerously unhinged. From that entrance thru most of the flick it’s debatable whether the character is or isn’t some sort of semilethal madman, which totally makes it worth watching.
Pretty good as a comment on our making the postseason, too…
I read somewhere that Gene Wilder insisted on doing his introduction as Willy Wonka that way. The director didn't want to do it but Wilder insisted on it, because it would leave audiences guessing for the rest of the movie about whether or not he's lying. I'd say it worked.
I had to look it up; the director is someone named Mel Stuart, who seems to have been a sort of journeyman. Did a bunch of "Making of the President" flicks in the before-CNN-times when people went to that sort of stuff. TV movies, plus the awesomely named "Call of the Wild - Sex in the Animal Kingdom" in 2003.
Why the producers of a Roald Dahl fantasy novel would tap somebody so normie to direct the picture I have NO idea. But I can totally imagine Stuart being completely baffled by what Wilder was doing.
Interestingly, the Wikipedia entry for "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" says that Dahl - who wrote the screenplay for the film - didn't like that the producers/director made the flick about the Wonka character instead of his kid protagonist.
Which just goes to show that great writers can be irrationally wedded to their creations, because who the hell wants more of Peter Ostrum playing the gruesomely loveable little Charlie Bucket when you can have Gene Wilder going mad, bad, and dangerous to know as the lunatic candymaker?
Ya know, as much as this season was largely a disappointment, the Thorns still gave me some unforgettable soccer memories this year: Gale’s first win, beating Orlando, and Sinc’s big send-off.
Bonus memories: Soph’s ball/bench hijinks, Coffey plowing through the ref, Sinc getting to score in her last game at Christine Sinclair Place.
I'd like Parsons for GM not because he's popular with the players or with fans - two very bad reasons - but because he appears to have an eye for talent. My impression is that the 2016-2021 signings were largely his picks; he identified the talent (presumably with input from scouts) and wooed the players, and Gavin Wilkinson went and signed them. That would include Lindsey Horan, Sophia Smith, Amandine Henry, Sam Coffey (started here in 2022 but drafted in 2021), AD Franch (back when she was one of the best), Ellie Carpenter, Becky Sauerbrunn, Meghan Klingenberg, Crystal Dunn, and Emily Sonnett, as well as a host of other fringe-USWNT-quality players like Weaver, Purce, Raso, Nadim, Salem, Rodríguez, Kuikka, Ryan, etc. (Not all of these are Americans but I think they'd be at least fringe USWNT players if they were.) Possibly Hina Sugita too, since identifying and wooing her probably started while Parsons was here. That's a pretty damn good track record.
I don't know if he'd be as good at Gavin at contract intricacies (league rules, money shuffling, handling existing contracts, etc.) to land targeted players, because AFAIK Gavin was one of the best at that, but at minimum Parsons appears to be good at identifying talent. Certainly the league has changed a lot, but the need to spot talent hasn't changed much.
I do agree with FDChief that if he were GM, he might have a hard time staying out of the head coach's bailiwick. Good management from above would help prevent this, but at this point we don't know if there IS good management above.
The five years when Parsons was here was our most successful period by a good margin. I don't think it's because Parsons was a tactical genius - he seemed middling in that regard - but more because we out-talented other teams. And that started with identifying the talent, for which I give Parsons a lot of the credit. My ideal would be to have a top-class GM - Parsons could be this - and pair them with a coach with vision who's good at tactics, motivation, training, and player development.
The problem with the "he's good at talent ID" argument for why Parsons would be a good GM is that most of the key pieces Gavin signed during the Parsons era that won us titles were huge, world-famous names....not scouting finds. To run through some of the players you mentioned:
- Lindsey Horan was quite literally the most famous non-Alex Morgan USWNT prospect EVER at the time she came over from PSG.
- Emily Sonnett was the clearcut #1 draft pick and the best college defender in the country when the Thorns picked her #1 in 2016.
- Amendine Henry was a superstar and won the silver ball in 2015.
- Ellie Carpenter was the youngest player to ever get a cap for the Matildas, the youngest ever female Olympian woso player, and one of the hottest teen soccer prospects in the world at the time she came to Portland.
- Becky Saurbrunn and Crystal Dunn were both established bonafide stars and forced their way here because of their partners.
- Meghan Klingenberg was a full US international when she came to Portland.
- Sophia Smith was the clear best non-Macario player in the country and threatened to not enter the college draft unless Portland had the #1 pick.
He absolutely gets credit for the 2021 draft (Yaz and Coffey), as well as Natu and Hina, both of whom from what I've heard were his finds. Nadia as well. Raso was a good player and a fan fave but I don't know if I'd call her anything but a high-level squad player. Rocky was a good player (though again, not a scouting find), but they traded Midge for her, who immediately popped for Gotham. Other than that, the Thorns' draft picks from 2017-2019 on were Savannah Jordan, Tyler Lussi, Caroline Flynn, Sandra Yu, Gabby Seiler, Bella Bixby, Emily Ogle, and Emily Curran. Only two of those players are even in the league anymore!
So, if you give him credit for luring the stars here, his record is awesome..... I just can't really get there given he presided over an era of Thorns soccer where they were the undisputed #1 destination in the states for the world's best talent AND he wasn't actually the GM.
The reality is that track record is as good as any GM they realistically can secure. I think the reason people give him credit for talent evaluation is he’s the one providing the scouting reports during the draft and talking about specifics on why they selected certain players. Discussing observations about Weaver and Smith at the US camps was interesting. To me, it seems like you are not excited because he has pre established relationships with their best players and knows the city.
Kate Markgraf is a known name with a decent track record.
I know the city even better and couldn’t GM if I got a tailwind and free money.
I think the point Parsons fans are missing is what kielbj is doing a good job of pointing out; in a free agent environment the trick isn’t going to be pals with pro players. It’s going to be 1) having deep connections inside places like the NCAA and foreign leagues (which aren’t a Parsons suit so far as we know…) and 2) negotiating with players and their agents, which he’s never seriously had to do because a huge proportion of the big signings in 2015-2021 wanted to come here and were just haggling over price.
Could he be terrific? Maybe! But I can’t help thinking that someone who’s worked as GM in a bidding league like the WSL might have more useful experience. I’d hate to pass over the chance to at least consider that option to get Parsons Era warm fuzzies…
Yep! I don’t want the Bhathals to limit their search to this league, much less “only people who know this club”.
I want them to scour the earth. I want them talking to people outside this organization AND this league! If they decide to settle on Parsons I want it to be after they’ve looked at dozens of candidates from all over the soccer world and concluded the he really does have the chops, not because Smith is his pal and he knows how to get to Powell’s…
The problems this club has had recently have a lot to do with internal hires and modest aspirations. Let’s not do that again.
I get that fear and it’s warranted after the coaching “search”, but I don’t want them excluding a qualified candidate because Karina hired a coach who didn’t deserve to be hired
He doesn't have a track record as a GM because he's never been one. That's just the fact, regardless of how much credit you want to attribute to him on the scouting front (though, also, he does not get credit for "scouting" Soph and Weaver any more than he gets for finding Henry, Kling, Dunn, Becky, Horan, or Sonnet). Also, even if he was an elite level scout, we're not hiring him to scout! We have scouts and technical staff who are paid to scout!
But broadly, you seem to be missing the point that I've reiterated several times now: I think Parsons would probably be a fine GM and his connection with the players and the City is a strong pro in his favor. My issue with hiring him is almost entirely what it would say about the organization's ability or lackethereof to find a high level external candidate for the position in a woso world where there has never been more talent and resources, something they have *quite literally never done*.
Kang became a better owner when she reached out and got Mark Krikorian to leave FSU when he had a contract dispute. New owners in the league need to hire someone who can bring them credibility and the GM is usually that hire.
Not sure the best GM’s in the league had a better CV than Parsons does now. West’s and Carter’s experience levels were akin to making Becky Sauerbrunn our next GM. What characteristics made it make sense at the time? Retrospec always allows for better decision making :)
I totally agree! That's why Parsons' lack of experience isn't at all, as I've mentioned, my issue with him as a candidate. It's also why I mentioned it might be a good idea to go get someone from Gotham or Orlando's organization, even if they haven't proven themselves as a GM just because they have that nous that comes with working with a successful organization.
Hiring is an imperfect science. My personal preference is that the Bhathals go hire someone who doesn't have a history with the Thorns organization to show that they have both belief in their own decision making and the pull to convince someone that the Thorns are a project worth investing time in. If that's not how you view it, that's totally fine!
In reality, I’ll admit I couldn’t name a good GM candidate from a list of secondary GM prospects for an NWSL team if my life depended on it. In reality, I think most of us would struggle with being competent at that.
If Parsons is hired, I can see why and I’d rather him than the current director of scouting.
If another person is hired, I’ll hope that two people without a soccer background can identify the best person for the job. It’s not like Gavin Wilkinson is advising them.
I’m really not going to have an opinion either way.
Nadia fell in Parsons's lap too. She made it clear that she wanted to come here after having played here when she was with Sky Blue. So, it was just a matter of making that happen.
I maintain that I will be pretty disappointed if they go that direction, but I will say that the biggest benefit of Parsons coming back would be his plus relationship with our two best players, both who will be on expiring contracts next season.
I don't want Screamy Shouty on the Sidelines Parsons here, and I've seen him do that here at times and he was definitely doing it at Washington leading up to getting sacked. If he comes here, I want to see the guy I've seen talking with fans at Annual Member events and such. I want to see the guy I've heard talking WoSo with good insight. And I want to see the guy who has good relationships internationally and an eye for talent.
There was nothing inherently wrong with screamy shouty Parsons- As someone who sat close behind the Thorns bench for a while during the Parsons era, he was always an extremely vocal manager even when things were going extremely well. It's not like he switched from a good guy to an yelly asshole, his tactics just didn't work in Washington.
One is that I think the day has changed. He could do that in the mid-2010s. I'm not sure he could do that in the mid-2020s.
The other is that he had Sinclair on the roster; that's no longer available to him.
Greg Poppovich used to tout Tim Duncan's importance to the Spurs success as including the way that Duncan would allow Pop to coach him.
I dare say that after Burke and Ward, the Spirit were in no mood to accept Parsons screaming at them, but they also didn't have someone on the roster who was willing to be coached that way.
Do the Thorns have a such a player, now that Sinc is retiring, who will accept being coached by Screamy Shouty Parsons? That, I don't know.
Eh, it's very important to distinguish between abusive and loud, or even just annoying and loud. Parsons was never an old-fashioned drill sergeant manager, he just was very talky on the sidelines. From what I've heard, his players have never had any issues with him as a person at any of his stops, and many former players seem to have excellent relationships with him. Even in Washington, he didn't get fired because he was shouty; he got fired cause his tactics were antiquated and Kang saw dollar signs shaped like Jonatan Giraldez. I also think, more generally, the shouty thing got blown out of proportion just because that's the part of him we see most often.
But also, he wouldn't be coming here to coach....or at least I sure hope not.
I believe in smart, organized people who can communicate and sell. I remember people being so pissed that the Celtics hired Brad Stevens as GM. The local kid was the boy wonder GM in OKC, but was under contract.
He’d be a stretch, but who are some names you’d like as GM.
I'm not judging people that want him to be GM, or even disagreeing that he'd probably do a good job. I'm explaining why I think he'd be an underwhelming hire because of what it would signal about where the club is at. If they had trust built up to the point where I fully believed whoever they hired would be the best fit, than, yeah! Go ahead and hire Parsons if he's the best choice. They don't at all have that trust built up.
As far as options, I'd like them to look at some of the GMs/PoFs that have done well around the world. Claudia Carrion with Club America is one. Sonny Karlson at BK Hacken is another. Intra-NWSL, I'd take a look at someone in the Orlando, North Carolina, or Gotham organizations who have been part of successful rebuilds.
But also: This is kinda my point. It's OK for fans to want Parsons because we're not experts on who is available or who the best management staffs are. If our FO is treating the GM search with the same resources and motivations we have as fans, that's an issue!
I don’t understand this sentiment. Almost anybody we hire for the GM position is going to be an unknown to us. Why not pick up a guy who has a good relationship with your best players and is known for team building?
- It's lazy. It's backsliding. It's fan service. It's nostalgia-hunting. It's going with what you know out of fear that the unknown might not work out.
- It's unambitious. It would show that either the Bhathals are unable or unwilling to attract a top tier GM outside of the Thorns eco-system.
- This "he's known for team building" thing is based on very little. He's never actually been a GM in his life- It's not like he was even acting GM when he was here! We had a GM who was, for his many faults, pretty good at the job. He was the coach at a time the Thorns were by far the most desirable team in the league and were therefore able to attract a slew of top-end talent who wanted to play in the states (most notably Henry, Sonnett, Horan, and Soph). He certainly does have a good eye for talent, but even then, the only real proof is that he hit in the 2021 draft with Yaz and Sam and liked Hina.
He might very well work out, I wouldn't be overly upset if they do hire him, and there are very real benefits to bringing him back if he's interested. But to me, it reeks of "oh our fans liked that guy when he was here a few years ago, no one will complain if we bring him back!" more than "we're going to go find the absolute best person for the job and build the Thorns into the best club in the world again."
Plus that even Parsons’ “team building” success came in a very different (i.e. pre-free-agency) league.
I agree that I wouldn’t be brokenhearted if Parsons gets the job. But to cite “was a popular favorite back in the day” and “the players like him” seems very like the reasons we heard for hiring KK, Norris, and Gale. Those examples don’t exactly fill me with confidence.
I have thoughts! (Been away from a proper keyboard for days and can't do the blur-thumb typing thing anybody born after 2000 does with zero effort.)
Thorns are presently in FIRST KEN WIN mode. Honestly believe this squad can face up against anybody, provided Ken sets them up to win. Will you do that for us all, Rob? Pretty please? PLEASE? Good god that monsoon match was so fun, so gratifying. Thorns playing with joy and purpose.
Know hope. Thorns can go on the road and grab a playoff win. Narrator: this is not a prediction.
Wow that game was everything emotional, exciting and remembering why we love these young women so much. Sinc was magisterial, what an exit! Hina; have we ever missed you! Actually, the midfield was so good all in their own way had great games. I think they all turned it up an extra notch for Sinclair as you can see she means a lot to Sam, Hina and Jessie of course. The fullbacks had their hands full with Angel City, but Wow is Payne fast or what! There was one play where Alyssa Thompson blew by her and Payne caught up enough to force a bad shot. Müller had her usual good game and Angel City is two deep in every attacking position. Plus a clean sheet. Soph and Weaver on the field at the same time was great to see unless you are a AC defender. Now lets hope for some NWSL chaos in the playoffs, Orlando deserves to win, but the NWSL doesn't always roll that way and as they say the ball is round.
It's also a reminder that Hogan, despite some limitations in other parts of her game, is a more athletic and intuitive shot-stopper than our other keepers.
Probably about the best result all things considered. Worst home crowd by far, no Chawinga/Rodman, have played Gotham decently. Still don't think they have an upset in them, but I like this matchup a little better on paper.
(plus, better chance of a home playoff game if shit gets wild!)
We've been a pretty poor matchup to them before now, and Gotham has been kind of on a tear since early September. I'm not sure this squad can reliably beat any top-four team, but of those we've done better against Washington than the other three...
They played Washington really well (in the first half at least) and won during the initial Gale run, but that was before the Spirit hit their stride under Giraldez. If we’re talking recent results, they got absolutely whipped by an undermanned Spirit team in the game where Santos scored that last minute winner- Single game xG isn’t always reliable, but the Spirit did have like 4 xG in that game alone if I remember correctly. I won’t argue too much if you think Washington’s a better matchup especially given their injuries, but I’m more scared of Washington’s high press and attacking speed than Gotham’s slow build. Gotham also always plays that suicidal high line against Smith, which has given them big trouble in the past.
Ultimately, I don’t really think it matters because it’s unlikely, as you say, that they beat any of them on the road
Gotham are a better version of themselves since the first time we met them, as they have added Berger and Carter. But, we should be better than we were back on August 24, as we were without Smith and Weaver, Obaze didn't play at all, and we were still at the point of starting Spaanstra. We should at least be deeper and back to full health. What we cannot do is fall behind early, as we did on August 24. We have to give ourselves a chance, even if it's just a puncher's chance, to win.
We never do very well against Gotham though, do we? This year we lost to them twice, and I don't remember many happy outcomes in previous years either. Didn't they dump us out of the playoffs last year?
I think they’ve played Gotham a little more closely than the results indicate. Really should have won both the semi last season and the early season game this year.
Again, there’s not one of the top 4 that I feel even remotely confident about getting a result against, but I’m more scared of the current version of the Spirit because of the matchup issues their attackers create. Plus, as I mentioned below, Gotham insist on playing a super high line and Soph tends to eat on those.
In reality, it’s been a while since we’ve been fully healthy. Whether it’s enough to upset Gotham is another story, but it’s no more unrealistic than a Gotham team coming into Portland and winning in 2023 after their struggles.
Tbf I don’t think anyone thought we were beating Gotham in the semi last season after how the regular season ended. Better comp might be when we lost the shield in 2022 by drawing that awful Gotham side away on the last day.
That 2022 final-game loss to Gotham is one of the most painful Thorns memories. Going into the final weekend we were one point ahead of Reign at the top of the standings, so a win would earn us the NWSL Shield. Gotham was a truly terrible team - they'd lost 12 straight, including a 5-0 thumping by the Thorns, and they hadn't scored a single goal in the previous five games. In the game, we were up by two soon after halftime and I was sure we had the Shield in the bag. But Gotham tied it up and Reign pipped us to the Shield. Just painful.
Assuming two simultaneous miracles, we host Bay FC for the semi, yes..? Club is asking for opt-outs and initially I laughed, until I remembered we finished 6th so mutual upsets should give us the semi.
Yeah, that was my laugh, because I knew the Final was a fixed venue, but I'd forgotten the possibility that the semi COULD be here. I'm not exactly holding my breath, but it's worth $17 bucks if we DO make it...
My seats for the two CONCACAF games were $30 a game per seat. For this theoretical playoff game it is $31 per seat. It is a deal, a good way to keep prices low to help pack the stadium with very little time to sell tickets.
At 34 pts each goal differential is why Thorns finish ahead of Bay, yes? I'd presume that extends to the playoffs unless they have double secret playoff tiebreakers I never heard of.
The league site says that the final seedings will hold through to the Final. So we're always going to host BFC (Chicago is in the other bracket, so the only way we'd host them would be if the Final still went to the higher seed...)
I'll have everybody know that I quite literally almost ran into Hina Sugita at the PSU farmer's market this morning and was incredibly awkward bc I have no idea how much english she understands, but I told her congrats on the award and gl in playoffs! But she was just as smiley and sweet as you'd expect!
Oh, and here’s just the perfectly adorable Hina-Sincy moment. At Sinc’s post match presser she takes a question (from someone we can’t see) but it’s Sugita-senshu. In this very hesitant tone she asks “Who will you miss the most…” at which there’s some crosstalk before Hina-san adds in an ever smaller voice “…and why is it me?”
I died from Utter Sweetness Overload.
FWIW the answer is that Sinc just thinks Hina-san is the Best Nicest locker buddy she’s ever had.
If you’re searching the Q&A comes at about 18:30 on the YouTube recording.
I think she might understand quite a bit but be reticent to speak if she feels self-conscious about her proficiency (e.g. I have a tiny smattering of Japanese from my kendo, but my accent is atrocious so I prefer to accompany a bow with “good morning” rather than “ohaio gomazu”.). So she probably understood your good wishes even if she didn’t answer directly…
That's "gozaimasu." Sorry...couldn't resist. ;)
ジョンさんもおはようございます、友よ!
But yes, even if Hina-senshu has amassed a decent amount of English, she might be self-conscious about using it in front of native speakers she's not friends with. I'm still like that, absolutely convinced I'll screw up even on stuff I know pretty well.
See? Like I said; I suck at basic Japanese even after years of being immersed in one of the most Japanese martial arts evah. So I totally get the reticence.
Probably more English than your Japanese, if I had to wager.
I can sing twinkle twinkle little star in Japanese and that's about it lol. A strange vestige of a young brain because a childhood best friend grew up in Okinawa.
But yes, I know she has likely picked up decent understanding the past few years.....but I do remember Rhian saying she knew 0 English when she came. I tried to keep it short, mostly because I just didn't wanna be weird lol.
Hina has been around here long enough to be fluent in English. There is a lot of down time for players that would give her the opportunity to take ESL classes. Then there's the fact that, unlike the United States, most countries in the world have learning teaching a second language as part of regular school.
And I believe that in Japan students are required to take at least a few years of English.
Absolutely true. But take it from someone who lives in Japan: Japanese schools' English teaching is shockingly bad for the most part, geared towards passing a basic exam (and promptly forgetting almost everything...). Especially away from "attractors" (places where the tourist industry draws English speakers) like Kyoto or the more central parts of Tokyo, the large majority of Japanese people have only a smattering of English phrases in their vocabulary.
Moreover, English is _hard_ for Japanese speakers (and vice-versa: I'm working hard for very modest progress in Japanese language school, and that's only partly down to me being "chotto baka"...a bit of an idiot). The very different grammatical structure, English's notorious inconsistencies, a new character set (albeit a simple one compared to Japanese's more-complex three), and pronunciation challenges make it difficult. The only advantage is that of Japanese's tons of "borrow words" imported from other languages, the large majority are from English; this kind of "preloads" their vocabulary of English words.
Okay, lots of rambling to just point out that while Hina has certainly learned some English, she may not necessarily be all that fluent.
I took a couple community college "adult learning" classes in Japanese several years ago. Yep. It is way different than English. Then it occurred to me that I never learn to read or write...so I switched to French.
I lived in Yokohama for 3 years in the mid 60’s (Navy brat) and had a fair amount of contact with Japanese nationals and I picked up only a handful of common phrases. Tough language to learn for sure.
Yay!! How’s her face looking?
You can see a bit of bruising still, but I was def not paying attention mostly because I am socially awkward lol. She had flowers and a coffee and was just standing there taking it all in. I think a lot of players go to this farmer's market....I've seen pics from multiple players being here!
And was Provenzano not escorting her!? (And Is that the real reason we keep re-signing her? Because if so, worth it)
Maybe Hina was waiting for her but I didn't see her. Tbf the PSU farmer's market is absolutely bumpin' and I kinda got tunnel vision when I saw Hina lol, and then I ran away quickly because I am weird.
Whatever your politics, I hope you will all join me in a strengthened determination to protect the rights of marginalized people. We need to stand up together for our beliefs.
I saw a post today: "I'm gonna wake up and keep trying to do good and so are you and nobody gets to vote on that."
Appreciate this. Woke up feeling incredibly heavy yesterday.
2016 - I got annihalated and regretted it
2024 - I stayed up and just pondered how things got the point where we elected whom we elected
I’m probably going to just lay low for 4 years and pray there isn’t another pandemic.
"Woke Up this Morning" means you're halfway to penning a blues song.
Had them Statesboro blues.
Were you on Jupiter?
Nope. Neutron star.
Do we think that, at this point, a lack of any sort of word from Kling and Sauerbrunn indicates that they both plan to return next year? Sinc may be THE goat, but Kling and Sauerbrunn are also even-toed ungulates who deserve a proper fan send-off.
I remember years ago Kling saying something to the effect that if the Thorns ever traded her she would just retire. A true loyal Thorn.
Edit: found it. https://x.com/OregonianSports/status/1044573495018115072
You know what, I've been thinking about it, and I do think there is a possibility that was Kling's last game. I thought it was interesting last night that it was her who subbed in for Sinc (even though I think she was on the IR for a possible calf injury.) The Riveters also held up a Kling jersey when she came on (maybe they know something...) But I've been seeing a lot of pictures posted from last night and I see Kling really losing it in a lot of them. Craig Mitchelldyer (former Thorns photog) posted several on IG and there's a really sweet one of Becky comforting her. It was during the rose ceremony, in particular when the team was holding hands/swinging arms and there's pictures where she's just losin' it. It reminded me of seeing Horan looking distraught on her last walk-around at PP after we lost to Chicago in the playoffs...and then soon after we found out she was leaving. With Kling, it made me wonder if she knows that was maybe her last game as well. I sure hope not. I hope she gives supporters a chance to celebrate her as well...
I do think Becky is def sticking around, though.
Sun Daze over on X is saying Kling's contract was not renewed.
Pointing out that nothing will probably be known officially about her situation until playoffs end. This might be it though.
Yeah I just went and looked. She did say she had no inside knowledge or anything, just that her contract hasn’t been renewed…
Becky’s contract hasn’t been renewed yet either but I can’t imagine she’s retiring…nor could I imagine not re-signing her if she still wants to play. That would be actually insane.
There are still a ton of players who are out of contract at the end of the season: Kling, Becky, Bella, Hubly, Provenzano, Asman, Hirst, McKenzie, Sheva, Kozal. I do imagine we part ways with some or many of these but not all of ‘em. I imagine KK should still be doing a lot of this work now, until the end of the season when she’s out. Otherwise, the new GM is gonna have a hell of an off-season to get through. Tons of new contracts, lots of dead weight, a retirement, and definite need to upgrade the roster with several elite players needed, as well as good depth. Hopefully Karina is making that job a little easier by doing some of the re-signing/housekeeping work now!
My guess is that this offseason is going to be pretty chaotic. Unless the squad runs the playoff table I have to think it’s getting a new gaffer. We know they’re getting a new GM. I’m guessing there’s already some roster moves planned.
So I’ll bet there’s going to be more than the usual interval w no signings news. FO might do handshake deals rather than commit new GM/HC to contracts they might want to negate before next season..?
So I might not want to read TOO much into the immediate lack of renewals/offers. Could be something…but also might not.
I wondered about both those details too. Have we *ever* seen Kling as a sub from Sinc?
Yeah why not Turner? She was warming up…
Kling, those tears in her tribute to Sinc probably weren't just about Sinc's departure.
A couple of years ago Sauerbrunn said that as long as a team will have her, she'll play.
It is my wish that Kling would retire of her own accord. Were it me, if I once was a regular starter when the day came that I wasn't, that is when I would retire. Kling has won every championship that is available (World Cup, NWSL, I don't recall if Olympic gold is another).
Personally, I get a sense of satisfaction when a player goes out on their own terms.
This is why I feel conflicted about Sinclair. Going out after the 2022 NWSL Championship Championship would have been perfect.
I don't think Kling has an Olympic gold medal. She wasn't on this year's team, and the previous time we won, in 2012, she was an alternate. I don't think alternates get a medal unless they make the bench (or the field) at least once, and I don't think Kling did.
What? You're saying Kling and Sauerbrunn both have an extra toe on each foot?
:-)
So…I tend to agree on Kling. Big, big part of the 2016-17 run, team huddle ranter, overall (as Sinc emphasized) “team spirit animal”. She deserves her own “send-off night” similar to what Sinc got.
Brunn? Sorta. She seems like terrific people and does deserve a salute when she hangs ‘em up.
But she’s played many more games - and bigger games - for the Kroyals in whatever form they took, FCKC or Utah, than she has for us. I’m not sure how she sees herself. But I still remember the goddamn goal she scored against us for Utah. I just can’t see her the same way I see Kling, or Sinc.
Great player? Ohhellyes. Great “Portland” player? I’d say “kinda”.
I understand this line of thinking with Sauerbrunn, but I would love to give her the benefit of the doubt of being a leader and stabilizing force on this team (and with the players union) while we were going through our mess.
I hope we give her the send off she wants.
Maybe it's because I'm a more recent Thorns fan but hard, hard disagree about Becky. Listening to her on Sam Mewis's podcast, among other things, she's such a hard care Thornie and Portlander. She deserves ALL of her flowers when she hangs up her boots.
Super, SUPER bummed to have had to miss that one live, but seemed like an awesome occasion and obviously an important result.
Gonna be real brave here and make it known that I think having Soph, Weaver, and Hina in the same lineup is pretty important! This is not a defense of Gale who has done the opposite of elevating the talent he's had available, but sometimes it can be as simple as "having your best players on the field = good." Not that anyone should have needed reminding, but Sophia Smith is really, really, REALLY damn good and her presence alone frees things up for everyone else.
Speaking of Soph Pt. 1: She's right. Angles are often deceiving, but I don't think this could be any more obvious. I don't blame her for rage-tweeting at 7 AM the morning after a 3-0 win. https://x.com/sophsssmith/status/1852713310476779590
Speaking of Soph Pt. 2: This is adorably sweet and hopefully a passing of the torch https://x.com/SportsonPrime/status/1852565000474284159
Super bummed to miss that as well. I had a ticket, but I also had the worst instance of insomnia I've had in decades and it ruined my whole day.
Many, many thanks for both links. That offsides call is galling, and all the more so w/ VAR at their disposal.
And I was really hoping someone would link that interview clip. As impressed as I am by her play (and I think she's already the most dominant pro athlete in the city's history), it's her thoughtful, genuine and enormously good-hearted nature that makes it all the more thrilling to follow her career at this close vantage.
agreed having soph on field freestyle things up immensely. However this is one of hale's biggest failures he has no idea how to get those freedom up players involved there is plan.
The offside call was a whole lot closer than that Xeet makes it appear - there's really deceptive perspective going on there - but I measured with lines in a freeze-frame and it still looked like she was onside. But only by inches, and if I was slightly wrong in either timing or measuring, she could have been off. Still think she was on though.
Glad it didn't matter.
I forget where I saw it, but someone did actual photogrammetry lines for this one and it was pretty clearly onside even if it that particular angle is a little deceptive. Like, very easily a clear and obvious error. Hell, even the back angle that they showed during the broadcast (which is more biased the other way) makes her look onside.
The biggest problem is that they have overturned other (much tighter) offside calls using the same angles. If they’re not going to use the tech, they have to be consistent with how they apply the clear and obvious metric.
Also this is hilarious:
https://x.com/838_carlisle/status/1852560936978014326
I love his Wonka; it’s so dangerously unhinged. From that entrance thru most of the flick it’s debatable whether the character is or isn’t some sort of semilethal madman, which totally makes it worth watching.
Pretty good as a comment on our making the postseason, too…
I read somewhere that Gene Wilder insisted on doing his introduction as Willy Wonka that way. The director didn't want to do it but Wilder insisted on it, because it would leave audiences guessing for the rest of the movie about whether or not he's lying. I'd say it worked.
I had to look it up; the director is someone named Mel Stuart, who seems to have been a sort of journeyman. Did a bunch of "Making of the President" flicks in the before-CNN-times when people went to that sort of stuff. TV movies, plus the awesomely named "Call of the Wild - Sex in the Animal Kingdom" in 2003.
Why the producers of a Roald Dahl fantasy novel would tap somebody so normie to direct the picture I have NO idea. But I can totally imagine Stuart being completely baffled by what Wilder was doing.
Interestingly, the Wikipedia entry for "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" says that Dahl - who wrote the screenplay for the film - didn't like that the producers/director made the flick about the Wonka character instead of his kid protagonist.
Which just goes to show that great writers can be irrationally wedded to their creations, because who the hell wants more of Peter Ostrum playing the gruesomely loveable little Charlie Bucket when you can have Gene Wilder going mad, bad, and dangerous to know as the lunatic candymaker?
Literally my favorite movie moment, and one I hope to recreate one day in my own life.
https://youtu.be/7Yq4mUKtPbI?t=28&si=c4Q5OmBxlCjRGpgQ
Ya know, as much as this season was largely a disappointment, the Thorns still gave me some unforgettable soccer memories this year: Gale’s first win, beating Orlando, and Sinc’s big send-off.
Bonus memories: Soph’s ball/bench hijinks, Coffey plowing through the ref, Sinc getting to score in her last game at Christine Sinclair Place.
I'd like Parsons for GM not because he's popular with the players or with fans - two very bad reasons - but because he appears to have an eye for talent. My impression is that the 2016-2021 signings were largely his picks; he identified the talent (presumably with input from scouts) and wooed the players, and Gavin Wilkinson went and signed them. That would include Lindsey Horan, Sophia Smith, Amandine Henry, Sam Coffey (started here in 2022 but drafted in 2021), AD Franch (back when she was one of the best), Ellie Carpenter, Becky Sauerbrunn, Meghan Klingenberg, Crystal Dunn, and Emily Sonnett, as well as a host of other fringe-USWNT-quality players like Weaver, Purce, Raso, Nadim, Salem, Rodríguez, Kuikka, Ryan, etc. (Not all of these are Americans but I think they'd be at least fringe USWNT players if they were.) Possibly Hina Sugita too, since identifying and wooing her probably started while Parsons was here. That's a pretty damn good track record.
I don't know if he'd be as good at Gavin at contract intricacies (league rules, money shuffling, handling existing contracts, etc.) to land targeted players, because AFAIK Gavin was one of the best at that, but at minimum Parsons appears to be good at identifying talent. Certainly the league has changed a lot, but the need to spot talent hasn't changed much.
I do agree with FDChief that if he were GM, he might have a hard time staying out of the head coach's bailiwick. Good management from above would help prevent this, but at this point we don't know if there IS good management above.
The five years when Parsons was here was our most successful period by a good margin. I don't think it's because Parsons was a tactical genius - he seemed middling in that regard - but more because we out-talented other teams. And that started with identifying the talent, for which I give Parsons a lot of the credit. My ideal would be to have a top-class GM - Parsons could be this - and pair them with a coach with vision who's good at tactics, motivation, training, and player development.
The problem with the "he's good at talent ID" argument for why Parsons would be a good GM is that most of the key pieces Gavin signed during the Parsons era that won us titles were huge, world-famous names....not scouting finds. To run through some of the players you mentioned:
- Lindsey Horan was quite literally the most famous non-Alex Morgan USWNT prospect EVER at the time she came over from PSG.
- Emily Sonnett was the clearcut #1 draft pick and the best college defender in the country when the Thorns picked her #1 in 2016.
- Amendine Henry was a superstar and won the silver ball in 2015.
- Ellie Carpenter was the youngest player to ever get a cap for the Matildas, the youngest ever female Olympian woso player, and one of the hottest teen soccer prospects in the world at the time she came to Portland.
- Becky Saurbrunn and Crystal Dunn were both established bonafide stars and forced their way here because of their partners.
- Meghan Klingenberg was a full US international when she came to Portland.
- Sophia Smith was the clear best non-Macario player in the country and threatened to not enter the college draft unless Portland had the #1 pick.
He absolutely gets credit for the 2021 draft (Yaz and Coffey), as well as Natu and Hina, both of whom from what I've heard were his finds. Nadia as well. Raso was a good player and a fan fave but I don't know if I'd call her anything but a high-level squad player. Rocky was a good player (though again, not a scouting find), but they traded Midge for her, who immediately popped for Gotham. Other than that, the Thorns' draft picks from 2017-2019 on were Savannah Jordan, Tyler Lussi, Caroline Flynn, Sandra Yu, Gabby Seiler, Bella Bixby, Emily Ogle, and Emily Curran. Only two of those players are even in the league anymore!
So, if you give him credit for luring the stars here, his record is awesome..... I just can't really get there given he presided over an era of Thorns soccer where they were the undisputed #1 destination in the states for the world's best talent AND he wasn't actually the GM.
The reality is that track record is as good as any GM they realistically can secure. I think the reason people give him credit for talent evaluation is he’s the one providing the scouting reports during the draft and talking about specifics on why they selected certain players. Discussing observations about Weaver and Smith at the US camps was interesting. To me, it seems like you are not excited because he has pre established relationships with their best players and knows the city.
Kate Markgraf is a known name with a decent track record.
I know the city even better and couldn’t GM if I got a tailwind and free money.
I think the point Parsons fans are missing is what kielbj is doing a good job of pointing out; in a free agent environment the trick isn’t going to be pals with pro players. It’s going to be 1) having deep connections inside places like the NCAA and foreign leagues (which aren’t a Parsons suit so far as we know…) and 2) negotiating with players and their agents, which he’s never seriously had to do because a huge proportion of the big signings in 2015-2021 wanted to come here and were just haggling over price.
Could he be terrific? Maybe! But I can’t help thinking that someone who’s worked as GM in a bidding league like the WSL might have more useful experience. I’d hate to pass over the chance to at least consider that option to get Parsons Era warm fuzzies…
That argument is pretty much available against any option that isn’t a proven NWSL GM last year.
Yep! I don’t want the Bhathals to limit their search to this league, much less “only people who know this club”.
I want them to scour the earth. I want them talking to people outside this organization AND this league! If they decide to settle on Parsons I want it to be after they’ve looked at dozens of candidates from all over the soccer world and concluded the he really does have the chops, not because Smith is his pal and he knows how to get to Powell’s…
The problems this club has had recently have a lot to do with internal hires and modest aspirations. Let’s not do that again.
I get that fear and it’s warranted after the coaching “search”, but I don’t want them excluding a qualified candidate because Karina hired a coach who didn’t deserve to be hired
He doesn't have a track record as a GM because he's never been one. That's just the fact, regardless of how much credit you want to attribute to him on the scouting front (though, also, he does not get credit for "scouting" Soph and Weaver any more than he gets for finding Henry, Kling, Dunn, Becky, Horan, or Sonnet). Also, even if he was an elite level scout, we're not hiring him to scout! We have scouts and technical staff who are paid to scout!
But broadly, you seem to be missing the point that I've reiterated several times now: I think Parsons would probably be a fine GM and his connection with the players and the City is a strong pro in his favor. My issue with hiring him is almost entirely what it would say about the organization's ability or lackethereof to find a high level external candidate for the position in a woso world where there has never been more talent and resources, something they have *quite literally never done*.
Kang became a better owner when she reached out and got Mark Krikorian to leave FSU when he had a contract dispute. New owners in the league need to hire someone who can bring them credibility and the GM is usually that hire.
Not sure the best GM’s in the league had a better CV than Parsons does now. West’s and Carter’s experience levels were akin to making Becky Sauerbrunn our next GM. What characteristics made it make sense at the time? Retrospec always allows for better decision making :)
I totally agree! That's why Parsons' lack of experience isn't at all, as I've mentioned, my issue with him as a candidate. It's also why I mentioned it might be a good idea to go get someone from Gotham or Orlando's organization, even if they haven't proven themselves as a GM just because they have that nous that comes with working with a successful organization.
Hiring is an imperfect science. My personal preference is that the Bhathals go hire someone who doesn't have a history with the Thorns organization to show that they have both belief in their own decision making and the pull to convince someone that the Thorns are a project worth investing time in. If that's not how you view it, that's totally fine!
In reality, I’ll admit I couldn’t name a good GM candidate from a list of secondary GM prospects for an NWSL team if my life depended on it. In reality, I think most of us would struggle with being competent at that.
If Parsons is hired, I can see why and I’d rather him than the current director of scouting.
If another person is hired, I’ll hope that two people without a soccer background can identify the best person for the job. It’s not like Gavin Wilkinson is advising them.
I’m really not going to have an opinion either way.
Nadia fell in Parsons's lap too. She made it clear that she wanted to come here after having played here when she was with Sky Blue. So, it was just a matter of making that happen.
Match report up: https://rivetingpdx.com/2024/11/05/thorns-fc-what-becomes-a-legend-most/
For what it's worth...
https://ibb.co/MG1TsMp
I maintain that I will be pretty disappointed if they go that direction, but I will say that the biggest benefit of Parsons coming back would be his plus relationship with our two best players, both who will be on expiring contracts next season.
Weaver loves him also...I saw a nice comment from her under his twitter post from the game.
I don't want Screamy Shouty on the Sidelines Parsons here, and I've seen him do that here at times and he was definitely doing it at Washington leading up to getting sacked. If he comes here, I want to see the guy I've seen talking with fans at Annual Member events and such. I want to see the guy I've heard talking WoSo with good insight. And I want to see the guy who has good relationships internationally and an eye for talent.
So the implication from this is how equally or more critical getting the coaching hire right is.
A strong coach with an equal- or-better c.v. will help Parsons the GM stay in his lane.
There was nothing inherently wrong with screamy shouty Parsons- As someone who sat close behind the Thorns bench for a while during the Parsons era, he was always an extremely vocal manager even when things were going extremely well. It's not like he switched from a good guy to an yelly asshole, his tactics just didn't work in Washington.
Well, a couple of things.
One is that I think the day has changed. He could do that in the mid-2010s. I'm not sure he could do that in the mid-2020s.
The other is that he had Sinclair on the roster; that's no longer available to him.
Greg Poppovich used to tout Tim Duncan's importance to the Spurs success as including the way that Duncan would allow Pop to coach him.
I dare say that after Burke and Ward, the Spirit were in no mood to accept Parsons screaming at them, but they also didn't have someone on the roster who was willing to be coached that way.
Do the Thorns have a such a player, now that Sinc is retiring, who will accept being coached by Screamy Shouty Parsons? That, I don't know.
Eh, it's very important to distinguish between abusive and loud, or even just annoying and loud. Parsons was never an old-fashioned drill sergeant manager, he just was very talky on the sidelines. From what I've heard, his players have never had any issues with him as a person at any of his stops, and many former players seem to have excellent relationships with him. Even in Washington, he didn't get fired because he was shouty; he got fired cause his tactics were antiquated and Kang saw dollar signs shaped like Jonatan Giraldez. I also think, more generally, the shouty thing got blown out of proportion just because that's the part of him we see most often.
But also, he wouldn't be coming here to coach....or at least I sure hope not.
I believe in smart, organized people who can communicate and sell. I remember people being so pissed that the Celtics hired Brad Stevens as GM. The local kid was the boy wonder GM in OKC, but was under contract.
He’d be a stretch, but who are some names you’d like as GM.
I'm not judging people that want him to be GM, or even disagreeing that he'd probably do a good job. I'm explaining why I think he'd be an underwhelming hire because of what it would signal about where the club is at. If they had trust built up to the point where I fully believed whoever they hired would be the best fit, than, yeah! Go ahead and hire Parsons if he's the best choice. They don't at all have that trust built up.
As far as options, I'd like them to look at some of the GMs/PoFs that have done well around the world. Claudia Carrion with Club America is one. Sonny Karlson at BK Hacken is another. Intra-NWSL, I'd take a look at someone in the Orlando, North Carolina, or Gotham organizations who have been part of successful rebuilds.
But also: This is kinda my point. It's OK for fans to want Parsons because we're not experts on who is available or who the best management staffs are. If our FO is treating the GM search with the same resources and motivations we have as fans, that's an issue!
I don’t understand this sentiment. Almost anybody we hire for the GM position is going to be an unknown to us. Why not pick up a guy who has a good relationship with your best players and is known for team building?
A few reasons:
- It's lazy. It's backsliding. It's fan service. It's nostalgia-hunting. It's going with what you know out of fear that the unknown might not work out.
- It's unambitious. It would show that either the Bhathals are unable or unwilling to attract a top tier GM outside of the Thorns eco-system.
- This "he's known for team building" thing is based on very little. He's never actually been a GM in his life- It's not like he was even acting GM when he was here! We had a GM who was, for his many faults, pretty good at the job. He was the coach at a time the Thorns were by far the most desirable team in the league and were therefore able to attract a slew of top-end talent who wanted to play in the states (most notably Henry, Sonnett, Horan, and Soph). He certainly does have a good eye for talent, but even then, the only real proof is that he hit in the 2021 draft with Yaz and Sam and liked Hina.
He might very well work out, I wouldn't be overly upset if they do hire him, and there are very real benefits to bringing him back if he's interested. But to me, it reeks of "oh our fans liked that guy when he was here a few years ago, no one will complain if we bring him back!" more than "we're going to go find the absolute best person for the job and build the Thorns into the best club in the world again."
What kielbj said.
Plus that even Parsons’ “team building” success came in a very different (i.e. pre-free-agency) league.
I agree that I wouldn’t be brokenhearted if Parsons gets the job. But to cite “was a popular favorite back in the day” and “the players like him” seems very like the reasons we heard for hiring KK, Norris, and Gale. Those examples don’t exactly fill me with confidence.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEwm0fv7OBA
I have thoughts! (Been away from a proper keyboard for days and can't do the blur-thumb typing thing anybody born after 2000 does with zero effort.)
Thorns are presently in FIRST KEN WIN mode. Honestly believe this squad can face up against anybody, provided Ken sets them up to win. Will you do that for us all, Rob? Pretty please? PLEASE? Good god that monsoon match was so fun, so gratifying. Thorns playing with joy and purpose.
Know hope. Thorns can go on the road and grab a playoff win. Narrator: this is not a prediction.
Playoffs are a different beast. Look at the Timbers in 2015; mediocrity thru the final weeks, then get insane and run the table.
Or the 2017 championship. The Damned owned us that season. Replay that Final ten times and Carolina wins nine of them.
So. Could this Thorns squad go on a tear and win it all? Sure! Long odds, for sure…but not impossible.
Or, say, Gotham last year! Sixth place during the regular season, then they win the title.
We're in sixth place this year....
Wow that game was everything emotional, exciting and remembering why we love these young women so much. Sinc was magisterial, what an exit! Hina; have we ever missed you! Actually, the midfield was so good all in their own way had great games. I think they all turned it up an extra notch for Sinclair as you can see she means a lot to Sam, Hina and Jessie of course. The fullbacks had their hands full with Angel City, but Wow is Payne fast or what! There was one play where Alyssa Thompson blew by her and Payne caught up enough to force a bad shot. Müller had her usual good game and Angel City is two deep in every attacking position. Plus a clean sheet. Soph and Weaver on the field at the same time was great to see unless you are a AC defender. Now lets hope for some NWSL chaos in the playoffs, Orlando deserves to win, but the NWSL doesn't always roll that way and as they say the ball is round.
For those who need a lift, here is Shelby Hogan saving 3 penalty shots:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23mgv6McnLM
Well, we might need that.
It's also a reminder that Hogan, despite some limitations in other parts of her game, is a more athletic and intuitive shot-stopper than our other keepers.
Can we have her count votes?
Thorns are going to Gotham. Sunday Noon Scheduled kickoff, game is on scheduled to be on ABC.
Playoffs are now locked in.
Probably about the best result all things considered. Worst home crowd by far, no Chawinga/Rodman, have played Gotham decently. Still don't think they have an upset in them, but I like this matchup a little better on paper.
(plus, better chance of a home playoff game if shit gets wild!)
We've been a pretty poor matchup to them before now, and Gotham has been kind of on a tear since early September. I'm not sure this squad can reliably beat any top-four team, but of those we've done better against Washington than the other three...
They played Washington really well (in the first half at least) and won during the initial Gale run, but that was before the Spirit hit their stride under Giraldez. If we’re talking recent results, they got absolutely whipped by an undermanned Spirit team in the game where Santos scored that last minute winner- Single game xG isn’t always reliable, but the Spirit did have like 4 xG in that game alone if I remember correctly. I won’t argue too much if you think Washington’s a better matchup especially given their injuries, but I’m more scared of Washington’s high press and attacking speed than Gotham’s slow build. Gotham also always plays that suicidal high line against Smith, which has given them big trouble in the past.
Ultimately, I don’t really think it matters because it’s unlikely, as you say, that they beat any of them on the road
Gotham are a better version of themselves since the first time we met them, as they have added Berger and Carter. But, we should be better than we were back on August 24, as we were without Smith and Weaver, Obaze didn't play at all, and we were still at the point of starting Spaanstra. We should at least be deeper and back to full health. What we cannot do is fall behind early, as we did on August 24. We have to give ourselves a chance, even if it's just a puncher's chance, to win.
I thought that Carter and Berger played the last time we played them though I will acknowledge I have been watching more casually than in past years.
They did. Gotham are stronger than they were at the start of the season. We're stronger than we were when we faced Gotham on Aug 24.
We never do very well against Gotham though, do we? This year we lost to them twice, and I don't remember many happy outcomes in previous years either. Didn't they dump us out of the playoffs last year?
I think they’ve played Gotham a little more closely than the results indicate. Really should have won both the semi last season and the early season game this year.
Again, there’s not one of the top 4 that I feel even remotely confident about getting a result against, but I’m more scared of the current version of the Spirit because of the matchup issues their attackers create. Plus, as I mentioned below, Gotham insist on playing a super high line and Soph tends to eat on those.
In reality, it’s been a while since we’ve been fully healthy. Whether it’s enough to upset Gotham is another story, but it’s no more unrealistic than a Gotham team coming into Portland and winning in 2023 after their struggles.
Tbf I don’t think anyone thought we were beating Gotham in the semi last season after how the regular season ended. Better comp might be when we lost the shield in 2022 by drawing that awful Gotham side away on the last day.
That 2022 final-game loss to Gotham is one of the most painful Thorns memories. Going into the final weekend we were one point ahead of Reign at the top of the standings, so a win would earn us the NWSL Shield. Gotham was a truly terrible team - they'd lost 12 straight, including a 5-0 thumping by the Thorns, and they hadn't scored a single goal in the previous five games. In the game, we were up by two soon after halftime and I was sure we had the Shield in the bag. But Gotham tied it up and Reign pipped us to the Shield. Just painful.
Winning the championship was a nice salve though!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H89Kovs8iI
45 minutes of Sam on the Women's Game. Apparently she bought a sailboat in Portland?
Assuming two simultaneous miracles, we host Bay FC for the semi, yes..? Club is asking for opt-outs and initially I laughed, until I remembered we finished 6th so mutual upsets should give us the semi.
Correct. And also when Chicago beats both Orlando and (probably) Washington, we'll be the home team for the final!
* Though it won't matter because the final is pre-set to be in KC.
Yeah, that was my laugh, because I knew the Final was a fixed venue, but I'd forgotten the possibility that the semi COULD be here. I'm not exactly holding my breath, but it's worth $17 bucks if we DO make it...
My seats for the two CONCACAF games were $30 a game per seat. For this theoretical playoff game it is $31 per seat. It is a deal, a good way to keep prices low to help pack the stadium with very little time to sell tickets.
Sincy would have to do her last game at PP all over again.
Works for me!
You've got moxy!
At 34 pts each goal differential is why Thorns finish ahead of Bay, yes? I'd presume that extends to the playoffs unless they have double secret playoff tiebreakers I never heard of.
The league site says that the final seedings will hold through to the Final. So we're always going to host BFC (Chicago is in the other bracket, so the only way we'd host them would be if the Final still went to the higher seed...)
Correct: the Thorns finished in sixth, one place ahead of Bay. On goal difference.
But it was a substantial goal difference, 12 goals!
Sophia Smith 2024 goal total: 12. Kismet!
Obviously that's because we had Smith and they didn't!
Election Day perspective:
“You won't have Dick Nixon to kick around anymore” (after Nixon lost his bid for California governor in 1962)
"You won't have Christine Sinclair for kickarounds anymore" (after Thorns lose their championship bid in 2024)