I like that the Timbers were pushing to try to get a third goal, but if they don't get it by around the 85th minute I'd rather see them get on the ball and close out the game. Don't give the opponent so much space late in the game. Everyone get back in a strong defensive mindset.
It seems Gio likes to handicap his team to make things interesting. Starting Mabiala and Loria, for example, when there is evidence that it is not a positive thing. Or not subbing Evander at 80, or even Boli earlier than he did.
The Timbers seemed on the verge of getting a two goal lead and then they weren't, and it cost them. Oh well, we're supposed to say?
Where is the lock it down mentality?
Great goal from Bravo and at that point being up was fortunate, but when your fortunes turn for the better, don't let the other team get a whiff. This seems so typical for the Timbers. Coaches are right sometimes and sometimes they are wrong, and Gio got it wrong this match. It's disappointing that they didn't move up the table and push Austin further down.
As much of a handicap having Loria and Mabiala is, I’m not sure there was anything else Gio could do. Play Clegg? He played well in the Open Cup but that was against a bad USL side, the kid has no MLS experience and we really have no idea how good he actually is. I would rather see Miller play CB but he had covid. Then our only other fully healthy winger we could’ve played was Gutierrez, and he didn’t even make the bench. Then outside of that it’s playing players out of position (I know you want to see Nathan play on the wing). I think Gio put the best lineup he could out there, and in all honesty, as much as I don’t want him on the field, I thought Mabiala did an alright job overall outside of the goal. Won 4 tackles, 7 clearances, 4 interceptions... he did ok. Maybe I just expect so little of him to the point where I was overly impressed with the marginally better play, idk
I do think Gio got a lot wrong in terms of tactics though, the formation kind of felt off the whole night, I couldn’t quite put my finger on it
Agree. His choices at CB were Mabiala, Zuparic and Clegg. With both McGraw and Miller out, it would have been much more risky to start a guy who has never played in an MLS game in his life.
In the midfield his options other than Loria were Blanco (would have been a weird choice as he probably would have to be subbed at half, was tactically there if we were chasing the game for a sub at 70 min), Yimmi also maybe 45 minutes, at most, in him, Asprilla also working back from another injury, and Caliskan who has never played an MLS game, was there primarily if D. Chara or Paredes got hurt.
While I didn't like the starting lineup either, Gio can't control the fact that his bench is T2 guys and injury rehabs that are even worse choices to start.
Well, yeah, go with Clegg over Mabiala. I think it's riskier to start Mabiala. He just slips up at the worst times. You can just about bank on it. Sure it is prudent to go with the vet, and that is the way this org does it time and time again. You expect a vet to go out and produce and for the most part he did a good job. It's just that he shuts off at the worst times.
There was much to like with Clegg's game. I haven't seen him in T2 action, but I saw a guy who is a really good passer, reads the game well. I imagine he'll get his chance against an MLS side Wednesday night. He and McGraw probably.
Sure, shuts off at the worst times. This is a liability known for two years. Why has he not been shipped out? Even waived if no trade takers. Hard to believe there is not a more reliable backup than Mabiala out there. If a Clegg is faster than Mabiala, then he is already a more reliable backup.
Faster maybe, but almost certainly Clegg, who doesn't even train with the 1st team and whose "top level" experience only includes playing an open cup game with mostly bench and T2 players on one day contracts is going to be prone to other mistakes.
If Gio starts Clegg and he ships 2-3 goals on pre-season rookie looking CB mistakes, the same people are on here bitching that at least with Mabiala we would have only given up one.
There has to be a reason we went out and got Miller as a (sort of) replacement for Tuiloma and didn't just promote Clegg, put him ahead of Mabiala in the CB pecking order. That reason is probably more than one man's opinion as I am sure management and assistant coaches gave input too.
Don’t disagree. Just making the point just about anybody with any kind of speed would be an improvement over Mabiala. Is there a MLS CB slower? If Clegg ships 2-3 goals thru rookie mistakes, and it seems you’re sure he will, that’s still fewer than Mabiala. But Savarese has his favorites, and Mabiala appears to one of them. Otherwise, Bill T. Would have stayed and Mabiala moved on.
RE playing players out of position: If Gio has Fogaca pegged as a center forward only, then he's missing out. I hope to see this at some point. Maybe Wednesday. It's all good. The Timbers didn't lose.
Then we're getting into the whole Jebo debate when we had a glut of forwards. We played him out of position and "ran him out of town" because we tried to see if he might do okay on the left wing because he was our best option there.
I want to see Fogaca play, and I don't really care where he plays - forward or wing. My guess is that on Wednesday Niezgoda gets the start at forward and Fogaca will be getting sub minutes. He'd been playing really well and then he doesn't sniff the field. Doesn't seem right.
I'd venture to say that playing wing didn't detract from Jebo's career trajectory. It probably motivated him to become a better forward for one, and I recall he got a lot more touches out on the wing and contributed to his development as a dribbler and passer. Granted, he became the guy in SJ, and the regular minutes and his overall good attitude and work ethic helped make him a better player, too. You can't get better on the bench.
Fogaca isn't high on the pecking order, and so any way to get on the field would be a win for him. What team doesn't ocassionally move guys around "out of position?" Pretty much every team does it.
The lack of scoring chances seems to pick up when there's more than one forward on the field at one time. So, get more on the field at one time. Play the smaller guy at winger. Simple.
Hey, I pretty much agree with everything you said. Of course playing Jebo out on the wing for some games did not hurt his career. Read social media and some commenters on here, though and Gio did something completely unforgiveable by seeing if a young player might be able to play another position.
Fogaca has the motor and has shown he can track back so why not take him for a spin on the wing sometime.
I've seen enough of some of the other options at wing. It could be that Fogaca gets the start and Niezgoda comes off the bench, but that seems to be a disservice to Niezgoda. So, play them together. I'd really like to see the Timbers advance tomorrow, and they need some firepower. Bring in Loria off the bench or Ikoba, or gutierrez.
Honest question: how is the kit choice made? I was looking forward to seeing the new plaid jersey a lot this year and they almost never wear it. The pink kit was fine last year when it was new and it feels like they wore it a lot last year but now I am really tired of it. I want to see the new kits and I want to see the Green and Gold!
About the game - I was worried when Austin brought in fresh attackers and we weren’t able to match that with fresh defenders because there was no one to put in. I don’t know if that would have prevented the goal but it seems Gio is really limited in what he can do at center back and it is a problem that has been obvious for at least a year. Zup is going to miss time for yellow cards too and there is no backup. They traded away Tuiloma and there was no plan for a replacement. I think the front office bears a lot of the blame for last night’s collapse. Of course if one of the other chances would have been put away the weak defense would not be the center of the attention.
Otherwise I thought there was a lot to like about how they played. Replace Loria with a healthy Yimmi or Asprilla and that is a formidable attacking team.
I wish I could like this comment multiple times. It's embarrassing that other teams get to wear green for Timbers home games and the Timbers have to wear those abominations.
And yes I'd still hate it even if I happened to like the Timbers' non-green kit. Home teams should be able to wear home colors, full stop.
As I understand it, the home team gets to choose its kit and then the visitors have to choose a kit with a contrasting color. Not sure how goalkeeper kits figure in - they're supposed to contrast with everything else out there, but I don't know when they're chosen. Referees choose last and also have to contrast.
So far this season we wore green at home against SKC and St. Louis and Orange County in the OC match. Pink vs LAG, Seattle and Austin.
On the road: Pink - LAFC, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis. Mint plastic recyclers against Cincinnati and primary green at Vancouver.
12 matches, 4 in green, 3 of which were MLS games.
They seriously must have screwed ordered way too many of those jerseys and need to use them up or something, because there is no other reason to keep wearing your secondary so much. On the road? I get it. Home? Wear green 90% of the time!
If I'm not mistaken, I think the home team gets to pick what kit they will wear. I'm with you on being very tired seeing that ugly NON Timbers color pink. I didn't like it from the get go last year. For me, it's the worst kit the Timbers have had since coming into MLS. I like their new green plaid kit. That should always be worn at home at least. I'd like to see next year's new secondary kit be white with green and gold trim. They have had something like that in the past and I think it's a sharp look. Others have said that it looks too plain. I think that would be a professional look getting back to the secondary kit being white with green and gold numbers and trim.
Annoyingly I don't think MLS requires a light and dark kit.
Charlotte has a blue primary (arguably "light" since it is a dark sky blue) and dark purple secondary. Columbus a yellow primary (arguably their light) and black secondary - Nashville the same. Cincinnati a blue and orange secondary (orange should contrast with about anything), Houston Orange and Black. LAG flips it on its head and has always considered its white its primary and has a green secondary, Vancouver the same (white primary, dark blue secondary), RBNY white with light blue accents with red is their secondary, NYCFC - man city baby blue primary and orange secondary. Both of Austin's kits are green (mint and the green/black we saw last night). Shittle a barf green/blue and a red secondary.
Time for MLS to tell teams they expect them to wear their primaries at home say 15 out of 17 times a year. For teams where their primary is white, pink, baby blue, orange, light yellow, etc. then the opposing team can wear their darker primaries to contrast. They seriously need to tell the Timbers to stop wearing pink at home.
Didn’t see the game, just highlights. I heard Mabiala was pushed. I thought he just Mia-timed the jump. I don’t know. The first goal bugs me more. I feel in general the back line has been better than past years. Maybe credit to Liam, some to McGraw. But goals are being allowed because of midfielders not tracking back. Anyone and his mother saw that player driving to the back post but while didn’t the team. Does anyone check their six. Unbelievable. Happy for Bravo and Z.
They paid the Mabiala tax at the end. He's too slow on the turn and lacks any makeup speed at all. Gio was up against it last night in his CB selection pool. It's really Ned's fault that Mabs hasn't been replaced.
Looking at that first goal: Timbers had numbers back - more so than Austin - but couldn't sort it out. Evander started tracking back from wide spot, and Loria from the middle, but neither picked anyone up.
Mabiala - typical game from him in that I think to myself, oh, he's doing pretty good this game, and then he has his Mabiala moments.
I felt awful after the game last night and I feel worse today. I hate it when other teams bunker, but that's just what the Timbers should have done last night. I know Gio's got very few options to Mabiala, but allowing him to push up the field isn't a winning plan. Mabs is just too slow to get back and defend. I think Gio was badly out coached last night. My guy Bravo finally scored. I always knew he had it in him.
What a disappointing result. Austin came out and didn’t play how they normally do. Credit to them for adjusting. You could tell it threw the Timbers off at first. A lot of passes went to where Austin normally wouldn’t be because of how they press but they held back and it took some time to adjust.
I do have to say I take hope in how our offense will be when Chara gets healthy. Completely different feel for both Moreno and Evander once he came in. Loria always took an extra touch. He slowed the ball down. Didn’t trust the easy pass and tried to hit the perfect pass but a beat too late. Also didn’t track on the first goal. I put that on him, but man our marking the in middle made me anxious all night. The second goal I don’t see a push, I see Mabiala misjudging the flight of the ball. I also don’t see one player complain about a push after they score.
If we can ever get healthy I have high hopes for this team.
That was a tough game for the Timbers. Felt like they had it but just couldn't finish out the game.
Now that I know that Miller wasn't available, I'm not sure what Gio had on the bench that would have helped. Neither Rasmussen not Clegg inspire any confidence in me, and I don't even get to see them in practice. While there is plenty to criticize Gio about, I don't see how either player helps the team. The mid-field also has this problem, where its Chara, Paredes and bunch of duct-tape. I feel like the game turned when we couldn't get that third goal when we had a few opportunities right in front of Austin's goal. Gotta put those on frame!
I think Evander is definately playing better, and is getting more involved in the play. Still a ways to go, and I agree that he should have been taken off around the 80th minute but once again who comes in for him? This team no longer has any depth, and we need someone desperately.
Finally, I think we are seeing the team for this year. With the loss of Williamson & Ayala and the trade of Tuiloma we are going to see the inability to bring in players at the end of the game. The offense is going to be fine, but if we are missing any of the starting defensive players its going to be scary at the end. Same goes with Chara and Paredes, if either of them miss games going forward its going to be rough. Lets hope one of Boli, Niezgoda or Nathan get going soon, as we are going to have to outscore opponents this year.
I thought the first half was alright, but not much the second half. We dominated a lot of stats at halftime but Austin beat us out in most of them over the full 90: possession, shots, xG, passes, crosses, duels... Boli looked good in the first half and then disappeared in the second until that one big chance where he did very well on initially and just messed it all up with the finish. Paredes was practically invisible almost the entire time on the offensive side of the ball, but of course he had good positioning and work rate defensively, and was a big reason Austin didn’t have much going through the middle either. Only 27 touches from a central midfielder at home is not good. For reference he had 49 touches at St. Louis. He had some really nice flicks and touches when he did get on the ball, but that didn’t happen enough. My main concern with him is that he can often disappear from games and doesn’t provide much in possession when it’s not a counter. I’m not yet worried about it because he’s played well so far this season, I was just a little disappointed because if he were on his game, I think we win. We really needed some more fire through central midfield, especially in the first half, as everything was going down the flanks. And on one of the flanks we have Loria, so it’s no bueno
Think I’ll do a compilation for Boli because there seems to be a lot of discussion around about whether he had a good game or not, I’m not really sure who else I could do. Moreno was pretty good, he had a beautiful touch in the first half intercepting a long ball, it was a work of art. Evander of course, but I’ve already done two for him and I thought he looked better against Cincinnati than he did this game
Evander did have 2 assists, the first one on a dime to Zups head. Not sure the commentariat is going to give Evander any credit until he absolutely dominates a game single-handedly and then be annoyed with him the next week when he doesn't replicate it.
The summary of that game was huge numbers of squandered opportunities for easy goals letting a team hang around and mental defensive mistakes (as much as it is easy to blame Mabs, there was no pressure on the ball outside letting Austin have a free cross into a 1v1 in the middle). The first goal was a bad give away counter with Loria ball watching the whole way back. He gets on his horse and picks up the man, he is in position to challenge and it was never a goal.
I'll give Evander credit for that pass; that was great to see. On the downside he needed to come off at the 80 mark at least. No defense at that point.
I mean, I guess if you want your 10 focusing on defense. I can't think of another Timbers 10 in the last 10 years who has been expected to be anything but an outlet.
But I was surprised it was Paredes coming off for Asprilla (when I saw him go to the sideline I thought Moreno or Evander). I know Paredes is just coming back from injury and has played quite a bit in the last 2 weeks after Ayala went down, but it just shows how bare the cupboard is in certain spots. That we would put Asprilla and Niezgoda in but not commit to holding the ball as a form of defense was just not smart soccer.
Right, your 10 focusing on defense? What? So leave him in?! I mean, if he plays defense, then by all means. But I haven't seen that the last two games in the last 10 minutes.
I for one would love to see that compilation, because Boli did not really do much for me last night. I get that, like Evander, there's an adjustment period there, but Boli's position is a lot more plug-and-play than Evander's, so the learning curve shouldn't be nearly as steep.
I also get that Boli's a stopgap, but last night didn't fill me with confidence that he will rise to even that level. So yeah, I'd love to see a video of his touches/work last night to see what I'm missing.
He had a lot of opportunity. A little better finishing quality and Boli has a brace last night.
We squandered way too much, let Austin hang around. As JJ says above, we pretty well dominated the first half but only had the 1 goal to show for it. Then came out and sat back, sat back, sat back - got scored on and then attempted to get back into it again.
Overall much better than a month ago, but still not productive when you HAVE to score 3 or more goals if you are going to play Mabiala the full 90 because he is going to give up one at some point.
Yeah, and honestly I put these two dropped points squarely on Gio. There's no reason to sit back and bunker with a one goal lead; they need to keep pushing and keep working as well as they did in the first part of the first half to, if not get a goal, at least threaten to, and to deny Austin possession.
The Timbers were passing and moving really, really well in the first half, for the first time almost all season. In the second half they reverted back to their tentative, what-do-we-do-now selves, which was ultimately their undoing.
They've shown they can be a good team when they're on the front foot, but so often in games they don't seem to think they're capable of being on the front foot for more than a few minutes at a stretch. There's a half-decent team hiding in this group, but Gio can't get any consistency out of them, and it's really annoying.
I don't think it really matters how many touches Paredes has. The fact is he came out of the game - and his work rate and defense - and Evander stayed in. Not sure how much of a sample size I have to see until that subbing pattern should be nullified.
Too me, Evander goes invisible at the 80 minute mark.
He is still working on fitness and post match Gio made a comment about people needing to come off to manage minutes specifically parades. I don’t think he wanted to take him off but had to with an eye on the future.
OK - that sounds like coach speak. Eye on the future - he really doesn't have much to play with being towards the bottom of the table. They really needed the three points. If he's managing minutes, then take him off earlier than at 80.
Yeah as Pdxsoccer mentioned, he’s still on minutes restriction. I just felt that this game we really needed more play and control through the middle, but we had nothing. Paredes isn’t the type of player to get on the ball in the first two thirds of the field and try to make things happen, he usually pops up in the final third as a late runner or a connector in the attack. Which is good, but I felt we needed more progression through the middle, which we didn’t get. Especially at home when we had more possession in the first half, we need to make that possession count. And when you have a central midfielder with so few touches, that’s where you get that problem. My gripes with Paredes are not about him having a bad game, I thought he was fine, but after last game where he was awesome I was hoping to see a resemblance of that again. I’m still hopeful he can be really good this year
I think having Ayala or Williamson on would’ve made a big difference, and then having Paredes come on for the second half with Austin down a goal would’ve really locked the midfield down. We could’ve had such a versatile midfield if Ayala and Eryk didn’t get injured... sigh, what could’ve been
The depth situation is what it is. I think Gio was wrong on a lot of fronts. A minutes restriction? I think he just wanted to get Asprilla in, and he didn't want to take Evander off. So, Paredes, it's you. Gio would have looked like a genius had anyone scored to go up by two goals. But, it's probably not a good strategy to go for goals when you have guys pushing up and have to rely on Mabiala. Granted, he played fairly well, except for that one long arcing cross that came his way.
Gio is in charge of the players and rotations, and I blame him mostly for the loss.
As far as Paredes goes, I don't think he needs a lot of touches to be effective, and for the midfield to control the game. He does what's needed. Against St. Louis they needed a ball chaser because they pressed. I think things bogged down because Loria was awful and Boli wasn't much better. I'm on the Niezgoda train right now because of his spacing and runs and he sets guys up really well. He looks like he's fit. Boli has been a little bit of a let down, and given that he's had some starts and not performed all that great, it's time to let someone else get a chance.
I'm actually looking forward to the Open Cup game because I'll get to see some players that I actually want to see playing - Niezgoda for one, and I hope Fogaca. He was playing really well and then he hasn't sniffed the field the past two weeks. I'd like to see him play left wing with Niezgoda up top and Blanco at the other wing. Clegg and McGraw at the back. I hope Ivavcic plays.
I like that the Timbers were pushing to try to get a third goal, but if they don't get it by around the 85th minute I'd rather see them get on the ball and close out the game. Don't give the opponent so much space late in the game. Everyone get back in a strong defensive mindset.
It seems Gio likes to handicap his team to make things interesting. Starting Mabiala and Loria, for example, when there is evidence that it is not a positive thing. Or not subbing Evander at 80, or even Boli earlier than he did.
The Timbers seemed on the verge of getting a two goal lead and then they weren't, and it cost them. Oh well, we're supposed to say?
Where is the lock it down mentality?
Great goal from Bravo and at that point being up was fortunate, but when your fortunes turn for the better, don't let the other team get a whiff. This seems so typical for the Timbers. Coaches are right sometimes and sometimes they are wrong, and Gio got it wrong this match. It's disappointing that they didn't move up the table and push Austin further down.
As much of a handicap having Loria and Mabiala is, I’m not sure there was anything else Gio could do. Play Clegg? He played well in the Open Cup but that was against a bad USL side, the kid has no MLS experience and we really have no idea how good he actually is. I would rather see Miller play CB but he had covid. Then our only other fully healthy winger we could’ve played was Gutierrez, and he didn’t even make the bench. Then outside of that it’s playing players out of position (I know you want to see Nathan play on the wing). I think Gio put the best lineup he could out there, and in all honesty, as much as I don’t want him on the field, I thought Mabiala did an alright job overall outside of the goal. Won 4 tackles, 7 clearances, 4 interceptions... he did ok. Maybe I just expect so little of him to the point where I was overly impressed with the marginally better play, idk
I do think Gio got a lot wrong in terms of tactics though, the formation kind of felt off the whole night, I couldn’t quite put my finger on it
Agree. His choices at CB were Mabiala, Zuparic and Clegg. With both McGraw and Miller out, it would have been much more risky to start a guy who has never played in an MLS game in his life.
In the midfield his options other than Loria were Blanco (would have been a weird choice as he probably would have to be subbed at half, was tactically there if we were chasing the game for a sub at 70 min), Yimmi also maybe 45 minutes, at most, in him, Asprilla also working back from another injury, and Caliskan who has never played an MLS game, was there primarily if D. Chara or Paredes got hurt.
While I didn't like the starting lineup either, Gio can't control the fact that his bench is T2 guys and injury rehabs that are even worse choices to start.
Well, yeah, go with Clegg over Mabiala. I think it's riskier to start Mabiala. He just slips up at the worst times. You can just about bank on it. Sure it is prudent to go with the vet, and that is the way this org does it time and time again. You expect a vet to go out and produce and for the most part he did a good job. It's just that he shuts off at the worst times.
There was much to like with Clegg's game. I haven't seen him in T2 action, but I saw a guy who is a really good passer, reads the game well. I imagine he'll get his chance against an MLS side Wednesday night. He and McGraw probably.
Sure, shuts off at the worst times. This is a liability known for two years. Why has he not been shipped out? Even waived if no trade takers. Hard to believe there is not a more reliable backup than Mabiala out there. If a Clegg is faster than Mabiala, then he is already a more reliable backup.
Faster maybe, but almost certainly Clegg, who doesn't even train with the 1st team and whose "top level" experience only includes playing an open cup game with mostly bench and T2 players on one day contracts is going to be prone to other mistakes.
If Gio starts Clegg and he ships 2-3 goals on pre-season rookie looking CB mistakes, the same people are on here bitching that at least with Mabiala we would have only given up one.
There has to be a reason we went out and got Miller as a (sort of) replacement for Tuiloma and didn't just promote Clegg, put him ahead of Mabiala in the CB pecking order. That reason is probably more than one man's opinion as I am sure management and assistant coaches gave input too.
Don’t disagree. Just making the point just about anybody with any kind of speed would be an improvement over Mabiala. Is there a MLS CB slower? If Clegg ships 2-3 goals thru rookie mistakes, and it seems you’re sure he will, that’s still fewer than Mabiala. But Savarese has his favorites, and Mabiala appears to one of them. Otherwise, Bill T. Would have stayed and Mabiala moved on.
RE playing players out of position: If Gio has Fogaca pegged as a center forward only, then he's missing out. I hope to see this at some point. Maybe Wednesday. It's all good. The Timbers didn't lose.
Then we're getting into the whole Jebo debate when we had a glut of forwards. We played him out of position and "ran him out of town" because we tried to see if he might do okay on the left wing because he was our best option there.
I want to see Fogaca play, and I don't really care where he plays - forward or wing. My guess is that on Wednesday Niezgoda gets the start at forward and Fogaca will be getting sub minutes. He'd been playing really well and then he doesn't sniff the field. Doesn't seem right.
I'd venture to say that playing wing didn't detract from Jebo's career trajectory. It probably motivated him to become a better forward for one, and I recall he got a lot more touches out on the wing and contributed to his development as a dribbler and passer. Granted, he became the guy in SJ, and the regular minutes and his overall good attitude and work ethic helped make him a better player, too. You can't get better on the bench.
Fogaca isn't high on the pecking order, and so any way to get on the field would be a win for him. What team doesn't ocassionally move guys around "out of position?" Pretty much every team does it.
The lack of scoring chances seems to pick up when there's more than one forward on the field at one time. So, get more on the field at one time. Play the smaller guy at winger. Simple.
Hey, I pretty much agree with everything you said. Of course playing Jebo out on the wing for some games did not hurt his career. Read social media and some commenters on here, though and Gio did something completely unforgiveable by seeing if a young player might be able to play another position.
Fogaca has the motor and has shown he can track back so why not take him for a spin on the wing sometime.
RE Fogaca: I hope so!
I've seen enough of some of the other options at wing. It could be that Fogaca gets the start and Niezgoda comes off the bench, but that seems to be a disservice to Niezgoda. So, play them together. I'd really like to see the Timbers advance tomorrow, and they need some firepower. Bring in Loria off the bench or Ikoba, or gutierrez.
Honest question: how is the kit choice made? I was looking forward to seeing the new plaid jersey a lot this year and they almost never wear it. The pink kit was fine last year when it was new and it feels like they wore it a lot last year but now I am really tired of it. I want to see the new kits and I want to see the Green and Gold!
About the game - I was worried when Austin brought in fresh attackers and we weren’t able to match that with fresh defenders because there was no one to put in. I don’t know if that would have prevented the goal but it seems Gio is really limited in what he can do at center back and it is a problem that has been obvious for at least a year. Zup is going to miss time for yellow cards too and there is no backup. They traded away Tuiloma and there was no plan for a replacement. I think the front office bears a lot of the blame for last night’s collapse. Of course if one of the other chances would have been put away the weak defense would not be the center of the attention.
Otherwise I thought there was a lot to like about how they played. Replace Loria with a healthy Yimmi or Asprilla and that is a formidable attacking team.
Why the actual fuck do we let other teams wear green at Providence Park? It feels like surrendering right from the get go.
I wish I could like this comment multiple times. It's embarrassing that other teams get to wear green for Timbers home games and the Timbers have to wear those abominations.
And yes I'd still hate it even if I happened to like the Timbers' non-green kit. Home teams should be able to wear home colors, full stop.
As I understand it, the home team gets to choose its kit and then the visitors have to choose a kit with a contrasting color. Not sure how goalkeeper kits figure in - they're supposed to contrast with everything else out there, but I don't know when they're chosen. Referees choose last and also have to contrast.
We are a pink team now.
So far this season we wore green at home against SKC and St. Louis and Orange County in the OC match. Pink vs LAG, Seattle and Austin.
On the road: Pink - LAFC, Atlanta, Dallas, St. Louis. Mint plastic recyclers against Cincinnati and primary green at Vancouver.
12 matches, 4 in green, 3 of which were MLS games.
They seriously must have screwed ordered way too many of those jerseys and need to use them up or something, because there is no other reason to keep wearing your secondary so much. On the road? I get it. Home? Wear green 90% of the time!
If I'm not mistaken, I think the home team gets to pick what kit they will wear. I'm with you on being very tired seeing that ugly NON Timbers color pink. I didn't like it from the get go last year. For me, it's the worst kit the Timbers have had since coming into MLS. I like their new green plaid kit. That should always be worn at home at least. I'd like to see next year's new secondary kit be white with green and gold trim. They have had something like that in the past and I think it's a sharp look. Others have said that it looks too plain. I think that would be a professional look getting back to the secondary kit being white with green and gold numbers and trim.
Annoyingly I don't think MLS requires a light and dark kit.
Charlotte has a blue primary (arguably "light" since it is a dark sky blue) and dark purple secondary. Columbus a yellow primary (arguably their light) and black secondary - Nashville the same. Cincinnati a blue and orange secondary (orange should contrast with about anything), Houston Orange and Black. LAG flips it on its head and has always considered its white its primary and has a green secondary, Vancouver the same (white primary, dark blue secondary), RBNY white with light blue accents with red is their secondary, NYCFC - man city baby blue primary and orange secondary. Both of Austin's kits are green (mint and the green/black we saw last night). Shittle a barf green/blue and a red secondary.
Time for MLS to tell teams they expect them to wear their primaries at home say 15 out of 17 times a year. For teams where their primary is white, pink, baby blue, orange, light yellow, etc. then the opposing team can wear their darker primaries to contrast. They seriously need to tell the Timbers to stop wearing pink at home.
Didn’t see the game, just highlights. I heard Mabiala was pushed. I thought he just Mia-timed the jump. I don’t know. The first goal bugs me more. I feel in general the back line has been better than past years. Maybe credit to Liam, some to McGraw. But goals are being allowed because of midfielders not tracking back. Anyone and his mother saw that player driving to the back post but while didn’t the team. Does anyone check their six. Unbelievable. Happy for Bravo and Z.
What do you mean, Loria saw him just 5 website too late.....
They paid the Mabiala tax at the end. He's too slow on the turn and lacks any makeup speed at all. Gio was up against it last night in his CB selection pool. It's really Ned's fault that Mabs hasn't been replaced.
Looking at that first goal: Timbers had numbers back - more so than Austin - but couldn't sort it out. Evander started tracking back from wide spot, and Loria from the middle, but neither picked anyone up.
Mabiala - typical game from him in that I think to myself, oh, he's doing pretty good this game, and then he has his Mabiala moments.
I felt awful after the game last night and I feel worse today. I hate it when other teams bunker, but that's just what the Timbers should have done last night. I know Gio's got very few options to Mabiala, but allowing him to push up the field isn't a winning plan. Mabs is just too slow to get back and defend. I think Gio was badly out coached last night. My guy Bravo finally scored. I always knew he had it in him.
Gio is outcoached most nights.
What a disappointing result. Austin came out and didn’t play how they normally do. Credit to them for adjusting. You could tell it threw the Timbers off at first. A lot of passes went to where Austin normally wouldn’t be because of how they press but they held back and it took some time to adjust.
I do have to say I take hope in how our offense will be when Chara gets healthy. Completely different feel for both Moreno and Evander once he came in. Loria always took an extra touch. He slowed the ball down. Didn’t trust the easy pass and tried to hit the perfect pass but a beat too late. Also didn’t track on the first goal. I put that on him, but man our marking the in middle made me anxious all night. The second goal I don’t see a push, I see Mabiala misjudging the flight of the ball. I also don’t see one player complain about a push after they score.
If we can ever get healthy I have high hopes for this team.
"Austin once again came from behind to peg the Timbers" . Yes, certainly felt like being pegged. From what I've heard. 😒
And without the courtesy of a reach around…
That was a tough game for the Timbers. Felt like they had it but just couldn't finish out the game.
Now that I know that Miller wasn't available, I'm not sure what Gio had on the bench that would have helped. Neither Rasmussen not Clegg inspire any confidence in me, and I don't even get to see them in practice. While there is plenty to criticize Gio about, I don't see how either player helps the team. The mid-field also has this problem, where its Chara, Paredes and bunch of duct-tape. I feel like the game turned when we couldn't get that third goal when we had a few opportunities right in front of Austin's goal. Gotta put those on frame!
I think Evander is definately playing better, and is getting more involved in the play. Still a ways to go, and I agree that he should have been taken off around the 80th minute but once again who comes in for him? This team no longer has any depth, and we need someone desperately.
Finally, I think we are seeing the team for this year. With the loss of Williamson & Ayala and the trade of Tuiloma we are going to see the inability to bring in players at the end of the game. The offense is going to be fine, but if we are missing any of the starting defensive players its going to be scary at the end. Same goes with Chara and Paredes, if either of them miss games going forward its going to be rough. Lets hope one of Boli, Niezgoda or Nathan get going soon, as we are going to have to outscore opponents this year.
I thought the first half was alright, but not much the second half. We dominated a lot of stats at halftime but Austin beat us out in most of them over the full 90: possession, shots, xG, passes, crosses, duels... Boli looked good in the first half and then disappeared in the second until that one big chance where he did very well on initially and just messed it all up with the finish. Paredes was practically invisible almost the entire time on the offensive side of the ball, but of course he had good positioning and work rate defensively, and was a big reason Austin didn’t have much going through the middle either. Only 27 touches from a central midfielder at home is not good. For reference he had 49 touches at St. Louis. He had some really nice flicks and touches when he did get on the ball, but that didn’t happen enough. My main concern with him is that he can often disappear from games and doesn’t provide much in possession when it’s not a counter. I’m not yet worried about it because he’s played well so far this season, I was just a little disappointed because if he were on his game, I think we win. We really needed some more fire through central midfield, especially in the first half, as everything was going down the flanks. And on one of the flanks we have Loria, so it’s no bueno
Think I’ll do a compilation for Boli because there seems to be a lot of discussion around about whether he had a good game or not, I’m not really sure who else I could do. Moreno was pretty good, he had a beautiful touch in the first half intercepting a long ball, it was a work of art. Evander of course, but I’ve already done two for him and I thought he looked better against Cincinnati than he did this game
Evander did have 2 assists, the first one on a dime to Zups head. Not sure the commentariat is going to give Evander any credit until he absolutely dominates a game single-handedly and then be annoyed with him the next week when he doesn't replicate it.
The summary of that game was huge numbers of squandered opportunities for easy goals letting a team hang around and mental defensive mistakes (as much as it is easy to blame Mabs, there was no pressure on the ball outside letting Austin have a free cross into a 1v1 in the middle). The first goal was a bad give away counter with Loria ball watching the whole way back. He gets on his horse and picks up the man, he is in position to challenge and it was never a goal.
I'll give Evander credit for that pass; that was great to see. On the downside he needed to come off at the 80 mark at least. No defense at that point.
I mean, I guess if you want your 10 focusing on defense. I can't think of another Timbers 10 in the last 10 years who has been expected to be anything but an outlet.
But I was surprised it was Paredes coming off for Asprilla (when I saw him go to the sideline I thought Moreno or Evander). I know Paredes is just coming back from injury and has played quite a bit in the last 2 weeks after Ayala went down, but it just shows how bare the cupboard is in certain spots. That we would put Asprilla and Niezgoda in but not commit to holding the ball as a form of defense was just not smart soccer.
Right, your 10 focusing on defense? What? So leave him in?! I mean, if he plays defense, then by all means. But I haven't seen that the last two games in the last 10 minutes.
I for one would love to see that compilation, because Boli did not really do much for me last night. I get that, like Evander, there's an adjustment period there, but Boli's position is a lot more plug-and-play than Evander's, so the learning curve shouldn't be nearly as steep.
I also get that Boli's a stopgap, but last night didn't fill me with confidence that he will rise to even that level. So yeah, I'd love to see a video of his touches/work last night to see what I'm missing.
He had a lot of opportunity. A little better finishing quality and Boli has a brace last night.
We squandered way too much, let Austin hang around. As JJ says above, we pretty well dominated the first half but only had the 1 goal to show for it. Then came out and sat back, sat back, sat back - got scored on and then attempted to get back into it again.
Overall much better than a month ago, but still not productive when you HAVE to score 3 or more goals if you are going to play Mabiala the full 90 because he is going to give up one at some point.
Yeah, and honestly I put these two dropped points squarely on Gio. There's no reason to sit back and bunker with a one goal lead; they need to keep pushing and keep working as well as they did in the first part of the first half to, if not get a goal, at least threaten to, and to deny Austin possession.
The Timbers were passing and moving really, really well in the first half, for the first time almost all season. In the second half they reverted back to their tentative, what-do-we-do-now selves, which was ultimately their undoing.
They've shown they can be a good team when they're on the front foot, but so often in games they don't seem to think they're capable of being on the front foot for more than a few minutes at a stretch. There's a half-decent team hiding in this group, but Gio can't get any consistency out of them, and it's really annoying.
I don't think it really matters how many touches Paredes has. The fact is he came out of the game - and his work rate and defense - and Evander stayed in. Not sure how much of a sample size I have to see until that subbing pattern should be nullified.
Too me, Evander goes invisible at the 80 minute mark.
He is still working on fitness and post match Gio made a comment about people needing to come off to manage minutes specifically parades. I don’t think he wanted to take him off but had to with an eye on the future.
OK - that sounds like coach speak. Eye on the future - he really doesn't have much to play with being towards the bottom of the table. They really needed the three points. If he's managing minutes, then take him off earlier than at 80.
Yeah as Pdxsoccer mentioned, he’s still on minutes restriction. I just felt that this game we really needed more play and control through the middle, but we had nothing. Paredes isn’t the type of player to get on the ball in the first two thirds of the field and try to make things happen, he usually pops up in the final third as a late runner or a connector in the attack. Which is good, but I felt we needed more progression through the middle, which we didn’t get. Especially at home when we had more possession in the first half, we need to make that possession count. And when you have a central midfielder with so few touches, that’s where you get that problem. My gripes with Paredes are not about him having a bad game, I thought he was fine, but after last game where he was awesome I was hoping to see a resemblance of that again. I’m still hopeful he can be really good this year
I think having Ayala or Williamson on would’ve made a big difference, and then having Paredes come on for the second half with Austin down a goal would’ve really locked the midfield down. We could’ve had such a versatile midfield if Ayala and Eryk didn’t get injured... sigh, what could’ve been
The depth situation is what it is. I think Gio was wrong on a lot of fronts. A minutes restriction? I think he just wanted to get Asprilla in, and he didn't want to take Evander off. So, Paredes, it's you. Gio would have looked like a genius had anyone scored to go up by two goals. But, it's probably not a good strategy to go for goals when you have guys pushing up and have to rely on Mabiala. Granted, he played fairly well, except for that one long arcing cross that came his way.
Gio is in charge of the players and rotations, and I blame him mostly for the loss.
As far as Paredes goes, I don't think he needs a lot of touches to be effective, and for the midfield to control the game. He does what's needed. Against St. Louis they needed a ball chaser because they pressed. I think things bogged down because Loria was awful and Boli wasn't much better. I'm on the Niezgoda train right now because of his spacing and runs and he sets guys up really well. He looks like he's fit. Boli has been a little bit of a let down, and given that he's had some starts and not performed all that great, it's time to let someone else get a chance.
I'm actually looking forward to the Open Cup game because I'll get to see some players that I actually want to see playing - Niezgoda for one, and I hope Fogaca. He was playing really well and then he hasn't sniffed the field the past two weeks. I'd like to see him play left wing with Niezgoda up top and Blanco at the other wing. Clegg and McGraw at the back. I hope Ivavcic plays.
LOL - I said loss.
It kind of feels like it. On the bright side, one loss in last five matches in all competitions.
Mabiala trying to jump while shuffling his feet* at the maximum speed they are capable of moving:
https://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Chain-Jump-Fail.gif
*Cant bring myself to call it “running”