It’s the penultimate home game for the Thorns, as they seek to consolidate first place in the table and lock up a spot in the postseason. Come talk through it in the match thread!
In the Reign/Courage match, Alana Cook took a blatant, though not dirty, DOGSO just outside the 18 to deny Kerolin an uncontested shot on goal. Cook obviously "took one for the team." NC failed to convert on the ensuing direct kick, and Reign held on for the draw. So, end justifies the means. Or does it? Cook, of course, has to sit out the next match. What do folks think about cynical DOGSOs?
I think in hindsight with the draw, it seems like the better of the two options because maybe it saved her team losing all 3 points (NC were eating them up a bit when I was watching.) Hard to say though... it was only the first half, and they would've had maybe a better chance at scoring with 11 to pull back level, rather than fighting with 10 (and an older team, might I add) to try and hold the tie. It was very much a no-fuss tactical red. I don't fault her for it at all, though...Dickey has had multiple derps like the one she had and she probably doesn't trust her. She knew what she was doing, and (for now) that point has them level with Orlando (ahead by GD) and still in playoff contention.
I don't see missing Cook as being that consequential tbh....they looked more cohesive defensively when Sonnet moved back to CB (her actual position), and they also have Holmes, Hiatt (who has mysteriously been benched), McClernon, Barnes who have also played CB. I don't think AC is much better (if any) than Hiatt, so it's been baffling she's been benched...They will be out Rose, Huerta, Stanton (card acc.), and possibly Fishlock though (she was struggling with that hamstring all night and eventually came out.) I think the combo of all of those things against the Spirit might prove to be messy, though. I give Spirit the upper hand in that game, but would love for it to be a draw.
With the way we're playing, we need all the help we can get from other teams...I'm really not confident against this Gotham team, considering our current defensive derps. If Norris continues on with his consistent tactical mess, and the fullbacks sit high allowing Midge Purce and Lynn Williams to eat up those wings, it's going to be a bloodbath (and not the good kind.)
It doesn't show a lot of confidence in your goalkeeper, does it? Cook did one thing right by tripping her outside the box but she could have let her go and run infield toward goal to let the keeper push the striker wide. Maybe Cook gets to goal in time to block a shot or clear a rebound.
I'm not convinced she did the right thing mostly because the next game is just as important as this one. If she lets it go and NCC score, then at least OLR still has 11 with plenty of time to equalize or even win - plus they would have their best 11 next week. As it was, maybe she saved a point, but also she basically squashed OLR's chances of getting three. And we'll see if they drop more points next match.
Wild end to the Gotham-Houston game. 10 minutes stoppage. Gotham scored right at beginning of stoppage, but ruled offside. Then a soft penalty called on Houston. Nighswonger took it and missed it. Then Iffy blows a sitter in the 100th minute.
Relevant: "OTD 2022 – OL Reign take advantage of Portland draw to win NWSL Shield on season's final day, 3-0 over Orlando. Over 10,000 see goals from Megan Rapinoe, Jordyn Huitema and Bethany Balcer in first 31 minutes. Caps 6-0-1 run down the stretch to nip Thorns."
SD only utilizing their wings (and still, meh), and yet, Mike still needed to push our fullbacks super high. Targeting Kling, specifically, and yet...Our midfield also is a hot mess.
I am not inclined to stick this result on the players. It was a close match, SD scored two fluke-ish goals and the bounces didn't go our way. Last year, we beat them with two worldies - these are evenly matched teams.
I AM inclined to pin the blame on the tactical decisions. First, starting Sugita, who had just spent 10 days on airplanes, over Moultrie simply makes no sense. When Moultrie did finally get on the pitch, she immediately showed why she should have been there at the start. How plain can it be? Moultrie is a 90' player for every game, like Coffey and Bixby. Write her in with a Sharpie, Mike.
Second, the substitutions were late and uncreative. The quality of our play dropped off instantly as Reyes and Hubly pumped short passes straight into touch and Vasconselos struggled to control most of the balls that came her way. Those subs weren't going to win this match. Instead, go to three in the back, pulling Kuikka for Sinclair. Put Moultrie in for Sugita (not Dunn). No further subs needed - we came off two weeks rest, it was a cool evening, we have a full week at home ahead, nobody was on a yellow.
Third, the tactics were repetitive, boring, easily defended. And they never changed, even when their futility was obvious. Abby Dahlkemper was facing Morgan Weaver, who has at least two steps on her if not four. It's obvious to pump long balls for Weaver to chase while Betfort and Dunn hustle to the box. So how many times did we do that? Zero. How often were we looking to try it but it didn't come off? Zero. How many minutes did Norris & Co. apparently spend thinking of ways to counter SD's setup? Zero.
We may yet back into the Shield. We may have not-won a must-win but still make the Final (ala 2022). We might even get a fourth star. None of which will change the need for major changes in 2024. The thin bench, watery gameplans, and week-to-week inconsistency is not the stuff of dynasty.
I could have sworn I replied on this point...probably forgot to hit the post button! Anyway, Sugita kikely only had two travel days: one to get there, one to come back. That entire training camp/friendly v Argentina was held in Kitakyushu (her home town!). Hina and the rest of the "first choice" Nadeshiko roster aren't on the Asian Games roster; that's been a collection of WE League players with only a handful of caps and even some high-school players (!). The camp ended 9/26, so Hina should have had at least a few days back stateside before the match.
That B team has been killing it, too: going in to the semifinals with a GD of 30 (smallest margin of victory: 6 goals). The next match, however, is going to be a LOT harder for them: China, who I believe have most of their WWC23 team. I plan to watch that today (it's 10/3 here in Sapporo as I write this), assuming it's on DAZN or I can find an, er..."alternate" stream.
Thanks, man! The final trip over here damn near killed me (only slightly exaggerating: I have slightly sketchy heart health). I posted something early in the trip about SeaTac being hot and humid... so naturally Haneda (Tokyo) had to provide a "that's adorable" moment. It was a frikkin' sauna, and I had a LONG walk from the baggage re-check (which you have to do after Immigration) to my gate. Missed the final connection to Sapporo when Immigration took longer than expected (first time on a long-term visa means you get your residence card issued right there and that takes a while), although there was another only an hour later. Then the train from Chitose airport to downtown Sapporo was really crowded as the Nippon-Ham Fighters baseball game had just ended.
But here I am, mostly settled in and ready for the language school term to start! It looks like I have one more chance to catch a game this season from the local WoSo side, Norddea Hokkaido, (third division and looking at near-certain relegation) plus looking into the first-division men's side, Consadole Sapporo. PTFCTID, of course, but I want to find and support the local teams, too! My beloved Tokyo Verdy Beleza will begin their WE League season soon (the WE League Cup is going on right now), but the closest match will be the away fixtures against MyNavi Sendai. That's a do-able trip, though!
Glad you're there and whole - yeah, that's kind of a brutal trip (we did Seattle-to-Nagoya on the way to Gaungzhou, and it sucked). Hope the adventure continues to be a good challenge!
You guys and your direct flights! When I went (1970) it was Haneda airport and the flight had to stop in Anchorage for refueling. And I was going to Hong Kong. The whole trip took very close to two days. My main memory was wandering around Haneda in a sleep-deprived daze, looking for a place to buy cigarettes. The thing my trip had in common with yours was the incredibly steamy weather.
There WAS a Delta direct to Narita from PDX, and they had terminal rights for a direct to Haneda that they never exercised. This trip was Eugene (I was living just east of Salem before moving) to SeaTac, then Haneda, then Chitose. Not too bad in terms of layovers - could have used a bit more time at Haneda, in fact - but I sure wasn't ready for the sauna even though I expected it.
It's segued into Autumn at last here in Sapporo. I'm enjoying it, as I know perfectly well the snow is coming...in abundance!
YES to all of this. Richard, I would love to hear you eventually start up your podcast again (after all of this *waves arms* settles)....I always seem to heartily agree with your assessment of things. And FDChief was a good counterbalance to your calm pragmatism (I mean that in the best way, FDChief...I lean towards hyper-realistic honesty often as well) ::)
I thought Sugita was sloppy, and Dunn a little less so. But Dunn was doing more overall on the offensive side of things. I don't know why, but Sugita was slow to make decisions, and often just went backwards. Dunn and Moultrie should've started. We need a better 3rd/4th forward option than dropping from Weaver to Betfort or Vasconcelos. Just, terrible F depth. Rocky was not good (came off of playing almost 2 full 90's for CR), but our system demands she play because you cannot play Porter in a game like this. Again, tactical inflexibility and roster construction issues piled up led by an inexperienced HC.
Subs were baffling. Couldn't believe he pulled Kuikka rather than Kling. Reyes still looks more comfortable on the L (her actual position.) Sending wide balls to Vasconcelos into the corner was pointless. I actually laughed out loud several times because I was like "uhm she's not skilled going 1v1...that's never going to work" and Pogarch easily contained her. Also thought a 3 back would've been the smartest. You're down 2 goals! Get some numbers up up up!
When the whole team looks bad, and is as inconsistent as we've been all season long, it's the coach. They just look hesitant, mostly, save for like 3 good games all season. Sophia Smith might've saved this one, but we wouldn't have deserved it. If anything, I hope the silver lining of not winning things this season means it's much easier to bring on new technical staff for next season. I know it's not over yet, of course, but this play ain't gonna get us much against Gotham or AC. 4 coaches in 4 seasons is ROUGH, but I think the Thorns could really falter next year if he sticks around. If Norris had the Houston roster instead of this Thorns roster...I don't doubt that he already would be faltering.
(Also side note- but blowing the end of the season really doesn't help our argument to keep our FA's here....)
Wow, we seldom see things differently, but I had the exact opposite take on Sugita/Dunn: I thought Crystal's accuracy was a bit off in comparison. She was being more aggressive on offense, but ineffectively. Hina was rather more cautious, but I thought that was because no one was really making good runs. My biggest complaint with her match was that she wouldn't try to take people on 1-v-1, and that's a missed opportunity.
I'm probably not going to have a rewatch because that game annoyed me, so I might not check for "fan bias" (I love Hina...), but I had a pretty different take on that specific point.
Yeah, we generally agree (because Hina is usually excellent lol.) I just didn't see that this game. She was one of the better players on the field, just seemed a little slower to make decisions and a little hesitant....maybe not her fault because her teammates looked poor. She went backwards oftentimes, which just contributed to no dynamic movement and very predictable play. She also was a little more slippery with the ball than her usual tidy self. Dunn wasn't perfect though either....she had a lot of giveaways, but I ultimately thought she was contributing to our offense a bit more, and we needed all the help we could get because it looked pretty sterile. Betfort just couldn't hang onto the ball...it was a mistake to play her as a lone 9. Weaver kinda reverted to rookie Weaver. So because our forwards were ineffective, Dunn was more dangerous because she's a quick dribbler and was able to pick up some of the slack on offense. Hina is just a different player, and when everyone around her is blowing it, she's not able to shine as much, and I think that was what happened. I too will not re-watch that one, I'll just rely on FDChief's nice postmatch write-up.
The box worked a lot better for the entire team, Hina included. As said, I don't think she was the worst on the field by any means, but I don't think she was super effective in whatever Norris was trying to do (most, if not all, weren't.) I just don't understand why he changed tactics so much from our great game over Reign, and when he finally adjusted it was a bit too late. Ultimately, Hina is starting quality and I just hope for the day where we have a coach that know how to use her superior qualities because she's one of my favorites when she's cookin'.
Again, this was just my eye test at the stadium, but I would've started all of Hina, Dunn, and Moutrie...and shifted one of them to RW to use as an inverted F like we've seen previously. Should've figured out how to get them all on the field...
FWIW I thought this was the single worst match Sugita has played this season. I'll say more in the match report at Riveting!.
And FWIW I'd love to resume the podcast, but - and it's not my story to tell, so... - I don't see that happening unless I can find someone who has both the 1) energy and the 2) sound recording setup. The old pod gang is gone past recall, I'm afraid...
I watched Sinc during warmups last night. She wasn't even warming up. She was standing next to the line of mids and forwards taking shots on goal, wearing her warmup top and perching her foot atop a ball. She had the distinct expression of someone who was taking it all in, banking memories, and processing. I think what we saw of her last night was about what we'll see of her against Gotham and if we get a home playoff match, especially if/when Sophia returns.
I noticed that as well. My thought at the time- "It seems like it really could be near the end for Sinc." Her body language pre-game coupled with being the final sub of the night seems to indicate that...
Lost in the fog of all our whinging over last night's loss, KC fell back to the bottom of the table. Still not dead, but will be if Reign win and NC win or draw today. So that's something we can all feel good about!
Meanwhile, Chicago are still alive and looking frisky after going 3-2-1 in their last 6 matches. They're just 3 points out of the playoffs despite that -16 GD.
"What worries me are 1) without Smith it’s gonna be tough to break down a Girma-led SD backline, while 2) letting the Wave hang around a scoreless match risks a defensive derp and shipping a crap goal; hopefully ‘Brunn will put some steel into our backline to prevent that, but it doesn’t take Pele’ to make a deflection or a defensive error and suddenly we’re down a goal.
We’ll see. But I’ll be really happy to see a couple of early Thorns goals."
Moultrie’s uncle is going HAM on twitter, posting things himself, replying to everyone who posts about Liv, about her not starting and only being subbed in. It’s the uncle, but I think they’re a close knit family from what I’ve seen in the past. The Moultrie family sounds frustrated, for sure.
Some of his words:
“In the span of 7 days the Portland Thorns extended Olivia Moultrie’s contract (no brainer) and promptly proved their incompetence by sitting her on the bench for 65 mins.”
And
“Why do the Thorns insist on wasting her on the bench for 65 minutes?! No one know.”
And
“The Thorns are ridiculous for not starting and playing Liv 90 mins every flipping game. Sure I’m her uncle, accuse me of bias; they are wasting her! Every meaningful statistic favors her over the women she competes for minutes with. Honestly just a huge joke“
I get the frustration. It is hard to be objective or reasonable as a family member especially when that player is a competitor and wants to be out there. Soccer is especially hard when you are playing at levels where there are not unlimited subs (ability to go in and out at will) and also attempting to maybe try something different for a game, etc.
That doesn't mean that there are not some boneheaded coaches out there. I sat by powerlessly for 4 years and watched my daughter's HS coach totally f it up. He was sitting a couple of the best players in the state because he didn't want to alter tactics and didn't want the blowback of sitting the players that he chose for varsity as freshmen who were now 2nd or 3rd best at their position as juniors and seniors, didn't want to deal with the politics of that because somehow making varsity as a freshman is tantamount to a promise to be the #1 in a couple of years. The school's JV teams (which he refused to have anything to do with, once you didn't make varsity they were to go to separate practices, separate games, see you at tryouts next summer) were always crazy good because of the players he would cut from varsity, often better than the ones he would keep. Four of the seniors went on to play college soccer, only 1 of them was a 4 year starter, 3 of them were on JV Freshman - Junior years then sat on the bench their senior years getting minimal playing time.
That long story is just to say that I get being a family member and being really frustrated with coaching decisions. But you also have to know that it does no good at all to express that frustration publicly and is only going to make you look bad and worse yet - make the player who you are trying to advocate for look bad (because this looks from the outside like Liv is complaining to her uncle about coaching decisions, even if she isn't).
Yeah I played for my high school (one who won a lot of trophies), and I definitely got to see the politics side of it first hand. I imagine the uncle's thoughts are not in isolation. Probably frustration bubbled over from the parents (and probably Liv herself over multiple seasons.) I really don't blame Liv if she's been unhappy for a few years now when her development has been start/stop because a player who has been terrible (but because of name) is standing in front of her and won't retire. I've been super duper frustrated about Sinc playing over Liv for the past 2 seasons now, so I can only imagine the frustration within. But, Liv has also been inconsistent. Is it because she's not getting consistent minutes? Because the coach is bad? Or because she's not ready? Little bit of a chicken and egg situation there...also probably little bit of everything. She should've been getting more consistent minutes 2 years ago, and we'd be a lot better off today if that were the case. We've also had two inexperienced head coaches the past two years, and Mike is especially inflexible once his tactics are set. Our formation did change though and now she's competing more so with Dunn and Sugita, which is much harder. I do get both sides, but it's dumb for the uncle to be so public about it. It puts Liv in a really awkward situation, even if she's been saying things to her family privately (which she should be allowed to do!)
Also, the Sinc issue has been an issue for multiple seasons now and we haven't had the stability for a FO or a coach to address it. These are just some of the issues that would inevitably reveal themselves after the FO chaos over the last 2-3 years. We knew Mark was leaving at the beginning of our 2021 season, and then of course we had the covid bubble of 2020. Things haven't been "normal" for this club since the 2019 season. That's nuts!
While I agree that this is some ridiculous nonsense from a family member to be chucking out into the world, it does raise a point that I was making last night to my daughter. Why, with Rocky on minutes from international duty and Crystal clearly on a managed schedule as well, you don’t start Liv? She’s fresh, she’s capable, and she can go at least 75’, right? For as good as Rocky played against OL, she played equally as bad last night. All those dribbles into defenders that came off then, absolutely did not last night. I think the messenger and tone is ridiculous, but the uncle is asking a question that needs to be asked. I’m not saying Rocky isn’t ahead of Liv on the depth chart, but Norris really botched the squad rotation last night, me thinks.
I think it's more so because our new formation is highly dependant on Rocky and Sam playing at all times, and we don't have another 6 that can step into that role. Porter instead of Rocky would've yielded the same or worse results. We're doing a double pivot now, and we really only have 2 defensive midfielders that can start, which are Rocky and Sam. Rocky obviously gets higher up at times and looks more like an 8, but she's being asked to play more defensively next to Sam. Liv cannot play the Rocky position as it's currently used, it's just not her skillset. The minutes Liv is fighting for in this system is against Dunn and Hina...Imo, the only way to get them all on the field would've been to push Dunn up to F along with Weaver, with Moultrie and Hina in midfield. Take Betfort out. We lose a lot of speed without Dunn in midfield, though.
Yeah, totally. I don't even know if the coach knows which formation he wants to play, though. Hina and Dunn worked well together in the box last week, but I would've loved to put Moultrie in the midfield with Hina, and push Dunn up. Those 4 would need to be tidy, though, because none of them have much pace, and with how high he plays the FB's, it could be dangerous to have turnovers. Basically I think our coach is the problem lol.
His niece's entire squad shit the bed last night, threw away the Shield, and this joker is pissing and moaning about his relative's minutes? GTFO. That's the worst soccer parent bullshit I can think of.
Yeah, it’s awful that he’s putting that out into the public sphere, where Liv also regularly interacts. Makes the whole family seem entitled to her career and really puts her in an uncomfortable position with her employer. Even if he’s right to some degree, this is some weird shit to do…family members, don’t do this!
When we were in a different formation and Sinc was playing, absolutely should’ve been Liv…hell, I crowed for multiple seasons about it. But now we play with 2 def mids and so Rocky has to play. Displacing Dunn or Hina at AM is much tougher.
She’s rostered in a midfield behind a slew of veterans with dozens to hundreds of international caps! “Much tougher”? Y’think?
Regardless of how you think of Moultrie’s skills compared to her teammates there’s no, zero, zip, nada excuse for this. As fans we might piss and moan about playing time or roster construction. That’s our job! As someone connected to a player - friend, family, agent - your job is to support the player and the player’s team. Period. Full stop.
Take this stuff to the management, keep it on the downlow. If you genuinely think her career is being stifled (by, again remember, sitting behind seasoned internationals, FFS!!!) then put out feelers to other clubs and bring that up privately to the GM.
But this is just the grossest “soccer dad” bullshit.
This very easily could and should have been a scoreless draw. Two costly defensive breakdowns in the 1st half.
There were some good individual performances, if nothing amounting to balls in the net. Weaver, Sugita, Coffey, Moultrie, and Dunn in particular. Betfort did some nice things too.
I was impressed by SD tonight. I've never seen another team dominate us with possession in our back third like SD during the 2nd half. They were disciplined, they are deep, and they are peaking at the right time.
It would be nice to win the Shield, but in truth it doesn't matter if we finish 1st or 2nd. To win the Championship, most likely we will have to beat SD in SD. I just don't want us to slip to 3rd (or even lower).
Thorns certainly had some good looks, probably should have had a couple of goals themselves, but poor shooting / finishing did them in there. A couple of derpy defensive mistakes with bad shooting and many teams lose 2-0.
I agree with you on being impressed with SD. For much of the game they just looked like they were on another level (faster, crisper, better team movement, more intelligent soccer).
We're likely headed into the playoffs, so there's that. This was a crap game, but it was ONE crap game after a hell of an outing against Seattle.
That said...the problem this season is that we can't string together two good performances. And in the playoffs - let's assume the worst and we go thru in fifth or sixth - we need to win THREE times in a row. Against other contenders, not fucking tomato cans.
Seattle is old and tired and was missing their offensive superstar and first-string keeper. SD was just the opposite of that last night.
Until the 20th minute, when SD broke through on a crap goal, there had only been 1 shot between them in the whole match, despite lots of pressure from Portland.
I like Bella as a person but I am so done with her as a goalkeeeper.
And tbh…I might be done with Nadine too. Compare Sheridan with Bixby: able to keep the ball, easily find her teammates with a variety of passes. The example of a modern goalkeeper. Not a single thorns keeper dating back to Franch has ever been better than mediocre at distributing.
And, it’s worth noting, that after seasons as the top statistical goalkeeper in the league this has been Sheridan’s worst year ever in the central metrics.
Goalkeeper distribution is a grossly overrated stat. But in all the critical metrics like xGa/G and goals prevented Bixby is having a hugely mediocre season. That alone is worth questioning the coaching.
Sheridan is in the 99th percentile for touches and has completed 100%, 98%, and 56% of short, medium, and long passes (all via FBRef).
Bella is in the 16th percentile for touches and has completed 96.8, 96.8, and 38.4 percent of short, medium, and long passes.
One goalkeeper is the modern goalkeeper here. San Diego always had an extra player to play out; the Thorns don’t have that because the minute Bixby has to do more than a 5 yard pass or a 20 yard chip she whacks the ball and possession is turned over.
Again; goalkeeper distribution is seldom a factor in game state. It’s nice to have and (in our current situation) frustrating when your keeper is poor at it.
I was frustrated just as much when Michelle Betos started here - similar problems (suggesting it IS an Angerer thing), so I tracked every punt, throw, and goal kick of Betos and our opponents for the 2015 season.
Results? Effectively a wash; in providing actual attack (or throttling defensive clearances) the times a keeper’s better distribution effected the results - compared to the work of the field players - was insignificant. Less than the margin of error.
I should Re-run that study just to confirm that it truly is a keepee thing not a Betos thing. But I think that keepee distribution is like “clutch hitting” in baseball; something that looks more impactful than it is.
I don't think so. I just think it's hard to displace the hometown-homegrown Bixby unless it's with someone who is clearly better for the team than she is. I've liked what I've seen from Hogan, but I'm not sure she's "clearly better."
In related, a while back KC Soccer Journal did brief audio interviews with the core KCFUBAR coaching staff.
I came away liking Sjöblom more than I had so far, yet remain unconvinced that Potter should have been fired, let alone that Sjöblom is the right person to make the permanent coach.
Sjöblom has had a long opportunity this season, with full support from the FO and the coaching staff, and yet KC sit in dead last... just where they were when Potter was sacked 3 matches into the season!
However, it became very clear to me what happened there, at least in large part, when Potter got the axe and Franch got benched for Miller.
Sjöblom is truly the manager, not the head coach, of KC, and her management style is very Scandinavian. Think Habermans meets IKEA's corporate practice of calling all employees 'co-workers.' Sure, there's leadership hierarchy in there somewhere, but the whole thing is heavy on process, dialogue, leveling, etc. Hopefully, there's also fika!
Sjöblom and her staff brainstorm and discuss things thoroughly, with everyone having opportunity to be heard and the best idea wins out.
That's not bad in theory, but I think it's also what the FO is wanting her to do and what they wanted Potter to do. And when he didn't do it because it muddied decision-making and also allowed in some bad ideas, well, Potter was the one to go.
I say this because apparently their GC coach, Yaxley, was seeing things in Franch's performance that he thought were contributing to the team performing poorly at the outset of the season, or at least that she was responsible for shipping some goals.
Without coming right out and naming names, during his KC Soccer Journal interview Yaxley said that he favors changing keepers during a season if there are problems, if in his opinion something needs to be fixed, etc., and that he doesn't hold back on this opinion in meetings. Rather, it's pretty clear he wants his opinion to carry the day.
On one hand, that makes sense. Why have an expert on your staff unless you're going to allow them to be the expert?
On the other hand, someone clearly went over Potter's head and complained that he wasn't implementing the co-workers' suggestions as shared at the weekly meetings!
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what happened here:
Yaxley wanted Potter to bench Franch, at least temporarily, to get things sorted out.
Potter either ignored Yaxley's recommendation or told him he was out of line.
Potter seems pretty old school, and I'm sure he recognized that KC would not have made the run they did last year or made it to the Championship match without AD in goal. Potter emphasizes culture too, but it's not democratic corporate culture and what the data show; it's loyalty and trust in your players.
When Potter was fired, the reasons given had to do with "team performance," "leadership," and "communication" with the FO and coaching staff.
There were probably other similar issues around tactics and lineups, with the coaching staff and the FO trying to have more voice than Potter was initially hired to give them. But surely the AD-to-the-bench thing was part of it. As soon as Potter was sacked, Franch was demoted.
Not really disagreeing cause I think they could use an upgrade at GK in general, but I don’t totally blame her for the goal- her plant foot slipped out from under her on the Morgan goal.
They’ve just been a little off all season. I noticed it in preseason games and it didn’t really change all season even though the overall play improved.
Our attacking personnel needs major retooling, as does our defense. As does our technical staff. The SD forwards they’re able to bring on as depth are so much better than anything we have past our first two…our F depth is laughable.
Agree with whoever said elsewhere here that pushing the backs forward isn't working too well. Holding Kling and Kuika mostly back a bit allows the mids more flow, which the transition. Keep a bit more disciplined back line. Kuika, Menges, Sauerbraun and Klingenbeg are solid. Mids of Coffee, Rodriguez, and Sugita work magic. With a mix of Moultrie and Sinclaire. The rest will open up. Especially when Smith comes back.
I think it’s been the consensus here among everyone all season. Neither Kling nor Kuikka are players who can pull that off, and to be fair, I don’t know many fullbacks who could. She got skinned all game, and it was absolutely baffling that he took Kuikka (rather than Kling) off for Reyes (who was also meh.) I’m not sure he was watching the same game, and his preplanned subs have made me crazy all season.
Sakina Karchaoui is one of my favorite fullbacks and she pushes up the field nicely and tracks back on defense adequately. Always wished she could be a Thorn or at least play in the NWSL.
Yeah, there are definitely elite FB’s who have the skillset and endurance to do so (Bacha also!), but they’re also surrounded by elite players and coached by an elite coach who knows how to adjust the rest of the players to have cover. We do have many elite players, but fewer in their prime and this is our HC’s first time ever being HC, so…
Betfort, our apparent 3rd F, is probably equivalent to SD’s 6th F. She’s fine…better than useless, but still should be a 20 min sub that’s used every now and then when we’re comfortably ahead.
Yeah, they’re gonna need to do work this offseason…and I’m not particularly confident they will. We don’t even know who “they” are. There are multiple areas that need improvement, and that’s not even considering the FA’s we could be losing to retirement or otherwise. Or an expansion draft. Do we get our 4th coach in 4 years? Next season could be…weird.
Of course, not in isolation was it Betfort’s fault, not at all…I don’t think I said that. Weaver had a poor night imo, along with mostly everyone not named Sam Coffey.
We’ve just settled on folks who should be much further down the depth chart. Our depth that I hear about isn’t really great after our first two subs….and then it falls off a cliff. Hubly…good depth. Same with Moultrie. I don’t really consider Betfort a “good” sub, let alone a starter, but we don’t have options. She’s a sub I’d only make if we were comfortably ahead. When SD can sub on Jakkobbsson at like 70’, it’s hard not to compare…again not just Betfort, it was just the example I gave because the F depth for each side was extremely lopsided. But that exists several places on our roster. Roster construction issues + shaky inexperienced coaching got us here. We’ve been riding a Parsons roster for years now…
Lol my partner and I were also noticing that they were terrible at offensive set pieces tonight…don’t think they got on the end of one of ‘em. Defensive have been a problem too, but my goodness what a waste tonight.
She slipped (like many players have in that box tonight) and made an awesome save on the Shaw FK. I’m a bixby skeptic generally and that was a frustrating goal to concede, but I find it hard to put that one fully on her.
I would love to have Kling here next season for her leadership (esp with new ownership), and to be a supersub coming in as needed, but a starter she is not. I'm not fully sold on Reyes being a full time starter though., either...she's a bit inconsistent (though I think coaching and tactics make them both worse than they are.)
Generally agree. I think Kling’s leadership also brings the traditional WoSo 1.0 “in your face, score 15 goals a game” mentality. She (and others) are a barrier to attractive, cohesive, opportunistic, patient, fluid soccer. Liv is the future. Kling is not. The up and down, kind of all over the place, effort and results kind of makes me wonder about the locker room leadership. I can’t remember her wearing the captain’s armband, in recent years anyway. I don’t necessarily think the captains are getting the team on an even keel either.
Both things are true. He does this every other game, and we also lose (or draw) every other game lol. The FBs stayed home more against the Reign, and, it worked better…as it does every time.
As I mentioned downthread, this team has been awful at throw-ins for as long as I can remember (and that's been since the team existed). It's odd: regardless of the lineup, coaching staff, opponent, etc., we suck at throw-ins. I don't get it...
Yes this, some. But the real problem is they seem to treat every throw-in as a chance to rest and regroup. They rarely just take the quick throw to the open player. And then since they're resting, they're not running or creating motion to get open. Almost never look for the long throw over the top either. Instead it's a short throw in traffic to a marked player with the idea that they'll be able to tap it back to the thrower who can pass out of the pressure. Only they're so tight there's no room. They basically turn every throw-in into a 50/50 ball. Oh, and they used to have Jessica McDonald, who's thows were nearly corners, thought they rarely used her.
She was seen as a pure striker when she was here; she didn’t take throws; she was there to score. It wasn’t until she went to Carolina that Riley started using her for them.
I’ve been tracking the throes this season, grouping them into “advanced tactical position/neutral ( neither gained nor lost)/lost possession or position”.
We’re roughly -10% on the positive AND negative throws - tend to have 10% fewer positive outcomes and 10% more negative ones.
I think a lot has to do with lack of motion off the ball. Our throws are typically to a player who’s already marked. The results are unsurprising.
Disappointing concession in that it began with one of our typically crappy throw-ins that immediately conceded possession. This team has never been good at throw-ins for some reason.
Also, so far lots of possession with very little danger resulting. Predictable balls into the box, easily read and dealt with...
Not that short, really: the friendly v Argentina was on the 23rd, although it was followed by a couple-three days of training camp work (and travel, of course). Like most of the "first team," she was not part of the Asian Games roster.
The latter team is on quite a roll, btw, despite being mostly WE League journeywomen with only a handful of caps and high-schoolers. They only got scored on for the first time in the tournament in yesterday's 8-1 destruction of Philippines. Goal differential of 30 going into the semifinals...
If it’s like last week, Coffey/Rocky double pivot with Rocky moving a little further forward, Hina and Dunn as wide 8s with Dunn playing more like a 10, and Betfort/Weaver up top.
Match report up at Riveting!: https://rivetingpdx.com/2023/10/02/thorns-fc-sneaker-wave/
In the Reign/Courage match, Alana Cook took a blatant, though not dirty, DOGSO just outside the 18 to deny Kerolin an uncontested shot on goal. Cook obviously "took one for the team." NC failed to convert on the ensuing direct kick, and Reign held on for the draw. So, end justifies the means. Or does it? Cook, of course, has to sit out the next match. What do folks think about cynical DOGSOs?
I think in hindsight with the draw, it seems like the better of the two options because maybe it saved her team losing all 3 points (NC were eating them up a bit when I was watching.) Hard to say though... it was only the first half, and they would've had maybe a better chance at scoring with 11 to pull back level, rather than fighting with 10 (and an older team, might I add) to try and hold the tie. It was very much a no-fuss tactical red. I don't fault her for it at all, though...Dickey has had multiple derps like the one she had and she probably doesn't trust her. She knew what she was doing, and (for now) that point has them level with Orlando (ahead by GD) and still in playoff contention.
I don't see missing Cook as being that consequential tbh....they looked more cohesive defensively when Sonnet moved back to CB (her actual position), and they also have Holmes, Hiatt (who has mysteriously been benched), McClernon, Barnes who have also played CB. I don't think AC is much better (if any) than Hiatt, so it's been baffling she's been benched...They will be out Rose, Huerta, Stanton (card acc.), and possibly Fishlock though (she was struggling with that hamstring all night and eventually came out.) I think the combo of all of those things against the Spirit might prove to be messy, though. I give Spirit the upper hand in that game, but would love for it to be a draw.
With the way we're playing, we need all the help we can get from other teams...I'm really not confident against this Gotham team, considering our current defensive derps. If Norris continues on with his consistent tactical mess, and the fullbacks sit high allowing Midge Purce and Lynn Williams to eat up those wings, it's going to be a bloodbath (and not the good kind.)
It doesn't show a lot of confidence in your goalkeeper, does it? Cook did one thing right by tripping her outside the box but she could have let her go and run infield toward goal to let the keeper push the striker wide. Maybe Cook gets to goal in time to block a shot or clear a rebound.
I'm not convinced she did the right thing mostly because the next game is just as important as this one. If she lets it go and NCC score, then at least OLR still has 11 with plenty of time to equalize or even win - plus they would have their best 11 next week. As it was, maybe she saved a point, but also she basically squashed OLR's chances of getting three. And we'll see if they drop more points next match.
Current NWSL Standings: (pending outcomes of OLR/NC and LA/ORL):
1 SD 33
2 POR 32
3 NJY 30
4 NC 29
5 WAS 29
6 OLR 28
7 HOU 26
8 ORL 25
9 LA 25
10 LOU 24
11 CHI 24
12 KC 22
Sheridan is all-time NWSL leader in PKs stopped. Campbell is 2nd.
Wild end to the Gotham-Houston game. 10 minutes stoppage. Gotham scored right at beginning of stoppage, but ruled offside. Then a soft penalty called on Houston. Nighswonger took it and missed it. Then Iffy blows a sitter in the 100th minute.
Houston up 1-0 at the half over Gotham.
The NWSL taketh, and then the NWSL giveth away.
Relevant: "OTD 2022 – OL Reign take advantage of Portland draw to win NWSL Shield on season's final day, 3-0 over Orlando. Over 10,000 see goals from Megan Rapinoe, Jordyn Huitema and Bethany Balcer in first 31 minutes. Caps 6-0-1 run down the stretch to nip Thorns."
Whoops: https://twitter.com/arielle_dror/status/1708570744568029204/photo/1
The pass maps for both teams are lol: https://twitter.com/arielle_dror/status/1708570746916573375
SD only utilizing their wings (and still, meh), and yet, Mike still needed to push our fullbacks super high. Targeting Kling, specifically, and yet...Our midfield also is a hot mess.
I am not inclined to stick this result on the players. It was a close match, SD scored two fluke-ish goals and the bounces didn't go our way. Last year, we beat them with two worldies - these are evenly matched teams.
I AM inclined to pin the blame on the tactical decisions. First, starting Sugita, who had just spent 10 days on airplanes, over Moultrie simply makes no sense. When Moultrie did finally get on the pitch, she immediately showed why she should have been there at the start. How plain can it be? Moultrie is a 90' player for every game, like Coffey and Bixby. Write her in with a Sharpie, Mike.
Second, the substitutions were late and uncreative. The quality of our play dropped off instantly as Reyes and Hubly pumped short passes straight into touch and Vasconselos struggled to control most of the balls that came her way. Those subs weren't going to win this match. Instead, go to three in the back, pulling Kuikka for Sinclair. Put Moultrie in for Sugita (not Dunn). No further subs needed - we came off two weeks rest, it was a cool evening, we have a full week at home ahead, nobody was on a yellow.
Third, the tactics were repetitive, boring, easily defended. And they never changed, even when their futility was obvious. Abby Dahlkemper was facing Morgan Weaver, who has at least two steps on her if not four. It's obvious to pump long balls for Weaver to chase while Betfort and Dunn hustle to the box. So how many times did we do that? Zero. How often were we looking to try it but it didn't come off? Zero. How many minutes did Norris & Co. apparently spend thinking of ways to counter SD's setup? Zero.
We may yet back into the Shield. We may have not-won a must-win but still make the Final (ala 2022). We might even get a fourth star. None of which will change the need for major changes in 2024. The thin bench, watery gameplans, and week-to-week inconsistency is not the stuff of dynasty.
I could have sworn I replied on this point...probably forgot to hit the post button! Anyway, Sugita kikely only had two travel days: one to get there, one to come back. That entire training camp/friendly v Argentina was held in Kitakyushu (her home town!). Hina and the rest of the "first choice" Nadeshiko roster aren't on the Asian Games roster; that's been a collection of WE League players with only a handful of caps and even some high-school players (!). The camp ended 9/26, so Hina should have had at least a few days back stateside before the match.
That B team has been killing it, too: going in to the semifinals with a GD of 30 (smallest margin of victory: 6 goals). The next match, however, is going to be a LOT harder for them: China, who I believe have most of their WWC23 team. I plan to watch that today (it's 10/3 here in Sapporo as I write this), assuming it's on DAZN or I can find an, er..."alternate" stream.
Yeah - I was exaggerating but that travel is still hard on the body, as you know.
I am happy that you finally made it Japan yourself, setbacks overcome and the dream fulfilled. Congrats!
Thanks, man! The final trip over here damn near killed me (only slightly exaggerating: I have slightly sketchy heart health). I posted something early in the trip about SeaTac being hot and humid... so naturally Haneda (Tokyo) had to provide a "that's adorable" moment. It was a frikkin' sauna, and I had a LONG walk from the baggage re-check (which you have to do after Immigration) to my gate. Missed the final connection to Sapporo when Immigration took longer than expected (first time on a long-term visa means you get your residence card issued right there and that takes a while), although there was another only an hour later. Then the train from Chitose airport to downtown Sapporo was really crowded as the Nippon-Ham Fighters baseball game had just ended.
But here I am, mostly settled in and ready for the language school term to start! It looks like I have one more chance to catch a game this season from the local WoSo side, Norddea Hokkaido, (third division and looking at near-certain relegation) plus looking into the first-division men's side, Consadole Sapporo. PTFCTID, of course, but I want to find and support the local teams, too! My beloved Tokyo Verdy Beleza will begin their WE League season soon (the WE League Cup is going on right now), but the closest match will be the away fixtures against MyNavi Sendai. That's a do-able trip, though!
Glad you're there and whole - yeah, that's kind of a brutal trip (we did Seattle-to-Nagoya on the way to Gaungzhou, and it sucked). Hope the adventure continues to be a good challenge!
You guys and your direct flights! When I went (1970) it was Haneda airport and the flight had to stop in Anchorage for refueling. And I was going to Hong Kong. The whole trip took very close to two days. My main memory was wandering around Haneda in a sleep-deprived daze, looking for a place to buy cigarettes. The thing my trip had in common with yours was the incredibly steamy weather.
There WAS a Delta direct to Narita from PDX, and they had terminal rights for a direct to Haneda that they never exercised. This trip was Eugene (I was living just east of Salem before moving) to SeaTac, then Haneda, then Chitose. Not too bad in terms of layovers - could have used a bit more time at Haneda, in fact - but I sure wasn't ready for the sauna even though I expected it.
It's segued into Autumn at last here in Sapporo. I'm enjoying it, as I know perfectly well the snow is coming...in abundance!
YES to all of this. Richard, I would love to hear you eventually start up your podcast again (after all of this *waves arms* settles)....I always seem to heartily agree with your assessment of things. And FDChief was a good counterbalance to your calm pragmatism (I mean that in the best way, FDChief...I lean towards hyper-realistic honesty often as well) ::)
I thought Sugita was sloppy, and Dunn a little less so. But Dunn was doing more overall on the offensive side of things. I don't know why, but Sugita was slow to make decisions, and often just went backwards. Dunn and Moultrie should've started. We need a better 3rd/4th forward option than dropping from Weaver to Betfort or Vasconcelos. Just, terrible F depth. Rocky was not good (came off of playing almost 2 full 90's for CR), but our system demands she play because you cannot play Porter in a game like this. Again, tactical inflexibility and roster construction issues piled up led by an inexperienced HC.
Subs were baffling. Couldn't believe he pulled Kuikka rather than Kling. Reyes still looks more comfortable on the L (her actual position.) Sending wide balls to Vasconcelos into the corner was pointless. I actually laughed out loud several times because I was like "uhm she's not skilled going 1v1...that's never going to work" and Pogarch easily contained her. Also thought a 3 back would've been the smartest. You're down 2 goals! Get some numbers up up up!
When the whole team looks bad, and is as inconsistent as we've been all season long, it's the coach. They just look hesitant, mostly, save for like 3 good games all season. Sophia Smith might've saved this one, but we wouldn't have deserved it. If anything, I hope the silver lining of not winning things this season means it's much easier to bring on new technical staff for next season. I know it's not over yet, of course, but this play ain't gonna get us much against Gotham or AC. 4 coaches in 4 seasons is ROUGH, but I think the Thorns could really falter next year if he sticks around. If Norris had the Houston roster instead of this Thorns roster...I don't doubt that he already would be faltering.
(Also side note- but blowing the end of the season really doesn't help our argument to keep our FA's here....)
Wow, we seldom see things differently, but I had the exact opposite take on Sugita/Dunn: I thought Crystal's accuracy was a bit off in comparison. She was being more aggressive on offense, but ineffectively. Hina was rather more cautious, but I thought that was because no one was really making good runs. My biggest complaint with her match was that she wouldn't try to take people on 1-v-1, and that's a missed opportunity.
I'm probably not going to have a rewatch because that game annoyed me, so I might not check for "fan bias" (I love Hina...), but I had a pretty different take on that specific point.
Yeah, we generally agree (because Hina is usually excellent lol.) I just didn't see that this game. She was one of the better players on the field, just seemed a little slower to make decisions and a little hesitant....maybe not her fault because her teammates looked poor. She went backwards oftentimes, which just contributed to no dynamic movement and very predictable play. She also was a little more slippery with the ball than her usual tidy self. Dunn wasn't perfect though either....she had a lot of giveaways, but I ultimately thought she was contributing to our offense a bit more, and we needed all the help we could get because it looked pretty sterile. Betfort just couldn't hang onto the ball...it was a mistake to play her as a lone 9. Weaver kinda reverted to rookie Weaver. So because our forwards were ineffective, Dunn was more dangerous because she's a quick dribbler and was able to pick up some of the slack on offense. Hina is just a different player, and when everyone around her is blowing it, she's not able to shine as much, and I think that was what happened. I too will not re-watch that one, I'll just rely on FDChief's nice postmatch write-up.
The box worked a lot better for the entire team, Hina included. As said, I don't think she was the worst on the field by any means, but I don't think she was super effective in whatever Norris was trying to do (most, if not all, weren't.) I just don't understand why he changed tactics so much from our great game over Reign, and when he finally adjusted it was a bit too late. Ultimately, Hina is starting quality and I just hope for the day where we have a coach that know how to use her superior qualities because she's one of my favorites when she's cookin'.
Again, this was just my eye test at the stadium, but I would've started all of Hina, Dunn, and Moutrie...and shifted one of them to RW to use as an inverted F like we've seen previously. Should've figured out how to get them all on the field...
FWIW I thought this was the single worst match Sugita has played this season. I'll say more in the match report at Riveting!.
And FWIW I'd love to resume the podcast, but - and it's not my story to tell, so... - I don't see that happening unless I can find someone who has both the 1) energy and the 2) sound recording setup. The old pod gang is gone past recall, I'm afraid...
I watched Sinc during warmups last night. She wasn't even warming up. She was standing next to the line of mids and forwards taking shots on goal, wearing her warmup top and perching her foot atop a ball. She had the distinct expression of someone who was taking it all in, banking memories, and processing. I think what we saw of her last night was about what we'll see of her against Gotham and if we get a home playoff match, especially if/when Sophia returns.
I noticed that as well. My thought at the time- "It seems like it really could be near the end for Sinc." Her body language pre-game coupled with being the final sub of the night seems to indicate that...
Lost in the fog of all our whinging over last night's loss, KC fell back to the bottom of the table. Still not dead, but will be if Reign win and NC win or draw today. So that's something we can all feel good about!
Meanwhile, Chicago are still alive and looking frisky after going 3-2-1 in their last 6 matches. They're just 3 points out of the playoffs despite that -16 GD.
From the preview comments:
"What worries me are 1) without Smith it’s gonna be tough to break down a Girma-led SD backline, while 2) letting the Wave hang around a scoreless match risks a defensive derp and shipping a crap goal; hopefully ‘Brunn will put some steel into our backline to prevent that, but it doesn’t take Pele’ to make a deflection or a defensive error and suddenly we’re down a goal.
We’ll see. But I’ll be really happy to see a couple of early Thorns goals."
Well...shit
Moultrie’s uncle is going HAM on twitter, posting things himself, replying to everyone who posts about Liv, about her not starting and only being subbed in. It’s the uncle, but I think they’re a close knit family from what I’ve seen in the past. The Moultrie family sounds frustrated, for sure.
Some of his words:
“In the span of 7 days the Portland Thorns extended Olivia Moultrie’s contract (no brainer) and promptly proved their incompetence by sitting her on the bench for 65 mins.”
And
“Why do the Thorns insist on wasting her on the bench for 65 minutes?! No one know.”
And
“The Thorns are ridiculous for not starting and playing Liv 90 mins every flipping game. Sure I’m her uncle, accuse me of bias; they are wasting her! Every meaningful statistic favors her over the women she competes for minutes with. Honestly just a huge joke“
I get the frustration. It is hard to be objective or reasonable as a family member especially when that player is a competitor and wants to be out there. Soccer is especially hard when you are playing at levels where there are not unlimited subs (ability to go in and out at will) and also attempting to maybe try something different for a game, etc.
That doesn't mean that there are not some boneheaded coaches out there. I sat by powerlessly for 4 years and watched my daughter's HS coach totally f it up. He was sitting a couple of the best players in the state because he didn't want to alter tactics and didn't want the blowback of sitting the players that he chose for varsity as freshmen who were now 2nd or 3rd best at their position as juniors and seniors, didn't want to deal with the politics of that because somehow making varsity as a freshman is tantamount to a promise to be the #1 in a couple of years. The school's JV teams (which he refused to have anything to do with, once you didn't make varsity they were to go to separate practices, separate games, see you at tryouts next summer) were always crazy good because of the players he would cut from varsity, often better than the ones he would keep. Four of the seniors went on to play college soccer, only 1 of them was a 4 year starter, 3 of them were on JV Freshman - Junior years then sat on the bench their senior years getting minimal playing time.
That long story is just to say that I get being a family member and being really frustrated with coaching decisions. But you also have to know that it does no good at all to express that frustration publicly and is only going to make you look bad and worse yet - make the player who you are trying to advocate for look bad (because this looks from the outside like Liv is complaining to her uncle about coaching decisions, even if she isn't).
Yeah I played for my high school (one who won a lot of trophies), and I definitely got to see the politics side of it first hand. I imagine the uncle's thoughts are not in isolation. Probably frustration bubbled over from the parents (and probably Liv herself over multiple seasons.) I really don't blame Liv if she's been unhappy for a few years now when her development has been start/stop because a player who has been terrible (but because of name) is standing in front of her and won't retire. I've been super duper frustrated about Sinc playing over Liv for the past 2 seasons now, so I can only imagine the frustration within. But, Liv has also been inconsistent. Is it because she's not getting consistent minutes? Because the coach is bad? Or because she's not ready? Little bit of a chicken and egg situation there...also probably little bit of everything. She should've been getting more consistent minutes 2 years ago, and we'd be a lot better off today if that were the case. We've also had two inexperienced head coaches the past two years, and Mike is especially inflexible once his tactics are set. Our formation did change though and now she's competing more so with Dunn and Sugita, which is much harder. I do get both sides, but it's dumb for the uncle to be so public about it. It puts Liv in a really awkward situation, even if she's been saying things to her family privately (which she should be allowed to do!)
Also, the Sinc issue has been an issue for multiple seasons now and we haven't had the stability for a FO or a coach to address it. These are just some of the issues that would inevitably reveal themselves after the FO chaos over the last 2-3 years. We knew Mark was leaving at the beginning of our 2021 season, and then of course we had the covid bubble of 2020. Things haven't been "normal" for this club since the 2019 season. That's nuts!
While I agree that this is some ridiculous nonsense from a family member to be chucking out into the world, it does raise a point that I was making last night to my daughter. Why, with Rocky on minutes from international duty and Crystal clearly on a managed schedule as well, you don’t start Liv? She’s fresh, she’s capable, and she can go at least 75’, right? For as good as Rocky played against OL, she played equally as bad last night. All those dribbles into defenders that came off then, absolutely did not last night. I think the messenger and tone is ridiculous, but the uncle is asking a question that needs to be asked. I’m not saying Rocky isn’t ahead of Liv on the depth chart, but Norris really botched the squad rotation last night, me thinks.
I think it's more so because our new formation is highly dependant on Rocky and Sam playing at all times, and we don't have another 6 that can step into that role. Porter instead of Rocky would've yielded the same or worse results. We're doing a double pivot now, and we really only have 2 defensive midfielders that can start, which are Rocky and Sam. Rocky obviously gets higher up at times and looks more like an 8, but she's being asked to play more defensively next to Sam. Liv cannot play the Rocky position as it's currently used, it's just not her skillset. The minutes Liv is fighting for in this system is against Dunn and Hina...Imo, the only way to get them all on the field would've been to push Dunn up to F along with Weaver, with Moultrie and Hina in midfield. Take Betfort out. We lose a lot of speed without Dunn in midfield, though.
Swapping Dunn and Hina positionally is so obvious that it's visible from orbit.
Yeah, totally. I don't even know if the coach knows which formation he wants to play, though. Hina and Dunn worked well together in the box last week, but I would've loved to put Moultrie in the midfield with Hina, and push Dunn up. Those 4 would need to be tidy, though, because none of them have much pace, and with how high he plays the FB's, it could be dangerous to have turnovers. Basically I think our coach is the problem lol.
His niece's entire squad shit the bed last night, threw away the Shield, and this joker is pissing and moaning about his relative's minutes? GTFO. That's the worst soccer parent bullshit I can think of.
Yeah, it’s awful that he’s putting that out into the public sphere, where Liv also regularly interacts. Makes the whole family seem entitled to her career and really puts her in an uncomfortable position with her employer. Even if he’s right to some degree, this is some weird shit to do…family members, don’t do this!
When we were in a different formation and Sinc was playing, absolutely should’ve been Liv…hell, I crowed for multiple seasons about it. But now we play with 2 def mids and so Rocky has to play. Displacing Dunn or Hina at AM is much tougher.
She’s rostered in a midfield behind a slew of veterans with dozens to hundreds of international caps! “Much tougher”? Y’think?
Regardless of how you think of Moultrie’s skills compared to her teammates there’s no, zero, zip, nada excuse for this. As fans we might piss and moan about playing time or roster construction. That’s our job! As someone connected to a player - friend, family, agent - your job is to support the player and the player’s team. Period. Full stop.
Take this stuff to the management, keep it on the downlow. If you genuinely think her career is being stifled (by, again remember, sitting behind seasoned internationals, FFS!!!) then put out feelers to other clubs and bring that up privately to the GM.
But this is just the grossest “soccer dad” bullshit.
This very easily could and should have been a scoreless draw. Two costly defensive breakdowns in the 1st half.
There were some good individual performances, if nothing amounting to balls in the net. Weaver, Sugita, Coffey, Moultrie, and Dunn in particular. Betfort did some nice things too.
I was impressed by SD tonight. I've never seen another team dominate us with possession in our back third like SD during the 2nd half. They were disciplined, they are deep, and they are peaking at the right time.
It would be nice to win the Shield, but in truth it doesn't matter if we finish 1st or 2nd. To win the Championship, most likely we will have to beat SD in SD. I just don't want us to slip to 3rd (or even lower).
Thorns certainly had some good looks, probably should have had a couple of goals themselves, but poor shooting / finishing did them in there. A couple of derpy defensive mistakes with bad shooting and many teams lose 2-0.
I agree with you on being impressed with SD. For much of the game they just looked like they were on another level (faster, crisper, better team movement, more intelligent soccer).
Gotham plays Houston tomm…I’m guessing unless something unconventional happens, we’ll be in 3rd by the end of the weekend.
Ordóñez is out with a concussion too.
Doesn’t bode well for us. Honestly don’t deserve any trophy with a performance like that, though.
We're likely headed into the playoffs, so there's that. This was a crap game, but it was ONE crap game after a hell of an outing against Seattle.
That said...the problem this season is that we can't string together two good performances. And in the playoffs - let's assume the worst and we go thru in fifth or sixth - we need to win THREE times in a row. Against other contenders, not fucking tomato cans.
Can we do that? Current form suggests....no.
Seattle is old and tired and was missing their offensive superstar and first-string keeper. SD was just the opposite of that last night.
Until the 20th minute, when SD broke through on a crap goal, there had only been 1 shot between them in the whole match, despite lots of pressure from Portland.
I’m gonna be so bummed if I get covid for watching that garbage…
I didn’t get covid and I’m STILL bummed. That’s two hours of my life I’ll never get back…
But imagine waking up a week from now with covid because you went to that game AND you lost 2 hrs of your life…lol
And Gotham hands us another L. at home.
I like Bella as a person but I am so done with her as a goalkeeeper.
And tbh…I might be done with Nadine too. Compare Sheridan with Bixby: able to keep the ball, easily find her teammates with a variety of passes. The example of a modern goalkeeper. Not a single thorns keeper dating back to Franch has ever been better than mediocre at distributing.
And, it’s worth noting, that after seasons as the top statistical goalkeeper in the league this has been Sheridan’s worst year ever in the central metrics.
Goalkeeper distribution is a grossly overrated stat. But in all the critical metrics like xGa/G and goals prevented Bixby is having a hugely mediocre season. That alone is worth questioning the coaching.
Sheridan is in the 99th percentile for touches and has completed 100%, 98%, and 56% of short, medium, and long passes (all via FBRef).
Bella is in the 16th percentile for touches and has completed 96.8, 96.8, and 38.4 percent of short, medium, and long passes.
One goalkeeper is the modern goalkeeper here. San Diego always had an extra player to play out; the Thorns don’t have that because the minute Bixby has to do more than a 5 yard pass or a 20 yard chip she whacks the ball and possession is turned over.
Again; goalkeeper distribution is seldom a factor in game state. It’s nice to have and (in our current situation) frustrating when your keeper is poor at it.
I was frustrated just as much when Michelle Betos started here - similar problems (suggesting it IS an Angerer thing), so I tracked every punt, throw, and goal kick of Betos and our opponents for the 2015 season.
Results? Effectively a wash; in providing actual attack (or throttling defensive clearances) the times a keeper’s better distribution effected the results - compared to the work of the field players - was insignificant. Less than the margin of error.
I should Re-run that study just to confirm that it truly is a keepee thing not a Betos thing. But I think that keepee distribution is like “clutch hitting” in baseball; something that looks more impactful than it is.
Did the ice bear melt?
I don't think so. I just think it's hard to displace the hometown-homegrown Bixby unless it's with someone who is clearly better for the team than she is. I've liked what I've seen from Hogan, but I'm not sure she's "clearly better."
In related, a while back KC Soccer Journal did brief audio interviews with the core KCFUBAR coaching staff.
I came away liking Sjöblom more than I had so far, yet remain unconvinced that Potter should have been fired, let alone that Sjöblom is the right person to make the permanent coach.
Sjöblom has had a long opportunity this season, with full support from the FO and the coaching staff, and yet KC sit in dead last... just where they were when Potter was sacked 3 matches into the season!
However, it became very clear to me what happened there, at least in large part, when Potter got the axe and Franch got benched for Miller.
Sjöblom is truly the manager, not the head coach, of KC, and her management style is very Scandinavian. Think Habermans meets IKEA's corporate practice of calling all employees 'co-workers.' Sure, there's leadership hierarchy in there somewhere, but the whole thing is heavy on process, dialogue, leveling, etc. Hopefully, there's also fika!
Sjöblom and her staff brainstorm and discuss things thoroughly, with everyone having opportunity to be heard and the best idea wins out.
That's not bad in theory, but I think it's also what the FO is wanting her to do and what they wanted Potter to do. And when he didn't do it because it muddied decision-making and also allowed in some bad ideas, well, Potter was the one to go.
I say this because apparently their GC coach, Yaxley, was seeing things in Franch's performance that he thought were contributing to the team performing poorly at the outset of the season, or at least that she was responsible for shipping some goals.
Without coming right out and naming names, during his KC Soccer Journal interview Yaxley said that he favors changing keepers during a season if there are problems, if in his opinion something needs to be fixed, etc., and that he doesn't hold back on this opinion in meetings. Rather, it's pretty clear he wants his opinion to carry the day.
On one hand, that makes sense. Why have an expert on your staff unless you're going to allow them to be the expert?
On the other hand, someone clearly went over Potter's head and complained that he wasn't implementing the co-workers' suggestions as shared at the weekly meetings!
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what happened here:
Yaxley wanted Potter to bench Franch, at least temporarily, to get things sorted out.
Potter either ignored Yaxley's recommendation or told him he was out of line.
Potter seems pretty old school, and I'm sure he recognized that KC would not have made the run they did last year or made it to the Championship match without AD in goal. Potter emphasizes culture too, but it's not democratic corporate culture and what the data show; it's loyalty and trust in your players.
When Potter was fired, the reasons given had to do with "team performance," "leadership," and "communication" with the FO and coaching staff.
There were probably other similar issues around tactics and lineups, with the coaching staff and the FO trying to have more voice than Potter was initially hired to give them. But surely the AD-to-the-bench thing was part of it. As soon as Potter was sacked, Franch was demoted.
Not really disagreeing cause I think they could use an upgrade at GK in general, but I don’t totally blame her for the goal- her plant foot slipped out from under her on the Morgan goal.
Hats off to SD. They had our number.
They control their destiny now. Gotham needs a bunch of goals to overtake them on GD.
NC needs to play spoiler next week for Thorns to have any chance now.
Can this guy say Sugita without sounding like he's doing dub-over on a 70's kung fu movie?
Why, oh why, can’t this squad string two good games together? Seems eminently do-able. We just can’t. Do. It.
They’ve just been a little off all season. I noticed it in preseason games and it didn’t really change all season even though the overall play improved.
Everything is just a foot or two off.
Frankly incredibly embarrassing performance
Our attacking personnel needs major retooling, as does our defense. As does our technical staff. The SD forwards they’re able to bring on as depth are so much better than anything we have past our first two…our F depth is laughable.
Agree with whoever said elsewhere here that pushing the backs forward isn't working too well. Holding Kling and Kuika mostly back a bit allows the mids more flow, which the transition. Keep a bit more disciplined back line. Kuika, Menges, Sauerbraun and Klingenbeg are solid. Mids of Coffee, Rodriguez, and Sugita work magic. With a mix of Moultrie and Sinclaire. The rest will open up. Especially when Smith comes back.
I think it’s been the consensus here among everyone all season. Neither Kling nor Kuikka are players who can pull that off, and to be fair, I don’t know many fullbacks who could. She got skinned all game, and it was absolutely baffling that he took Kuikka (rather than Kling) off for Reyes (who was also meh.) I’m not sure he was watching the same game, and his preplanned subs have made me crazy all season.
Sakina Karchaoui is one of my favorite fullbacks and she pushes up the field nicely and tracks back on defense adequately. Always wished she could be a Thorn or at least play in the NWSL.
Yeah, there are definitely elite FB’s who have the skillset and endurance to do so (Bacha also!), but they’re also surrounded by elite players and coached by an elite coach who knows how to adjust the rest of the players to have cover. We do have many elite players, but fewer in their prime and this is our HC’s first time ever being HC, so…
If you're gonna play that way the mids have to drop in. We don't seem to switch much. More clogged and countered
Yep- we’ve been talking about the forward depth since last season. Betfort has improved from useless to semi-competent, but she still ain’t it.
Betfort, our apparent 3rd F, is probably equivalent to SD’s 6th F. She’s fine…better than useless, but still should be a 20 min sub that’s used every now and then when we’re comfortably ahead.
Yeah, they’re gonna need to do work this offseason…and I’m not particularly confident they will. We don’t even know who “they” are. There are multiple areas that need improvement, and that’s not even considering the FA’s we could be losing to retirement or otherwise. Or an expansion draft. Do we get our 4th coach in 4 years? Next season could be…weird.
Two words to deal with our forward depth problem (and create another one: who's actually the "depth?"): Aoba Fujino.
Betfort's not the reason we didn't score tonight. She set up Weaver twice only to have Weaver sky it both times.
But you're right that SD have more depth than we do. That's a roster construction problem, though, not a Betfort problem.
This team might not go much further this season, but it definitely isn't going anywhere without Smith in the attack.
Of course, not in isolation was it Betfort’s fault, not at all…I don’t think I said that. Weaver had a poor night imo, along with mostly everyone not named Sam Coffey.
We’ve just settled on folks who should be much further down the depth chart. Our depth that I hear about isn’t really great after our first two subs….and then it falls off a cliff. Hubly…good depth. Same with Moultrie. I don’t really consider Betfort a “good” sub, let alone a starter, but we don’t have options. She’s a sub I’d only make if we were comfortably ahead. When SD can sub on Jakkobbsson at like 70’, it’s hard not to compare…again not just Betfort, it was just the example I gave because the F depth for each side was extremely lopsided. But that exists several places on our roster. Roster construction issues + shaky inexperienced coaching got us here. We’ve been riding a Parsons roster for years now…
Yeah two wins out of seven doesn't look promising.
Yep. Just embarrassing. No attack and shanking the shots we did get. Ship some crap goals and there you are…
You were definately right to not be optimistic about this match.
Some things I’d rather be wrong about…
So much self inflicted pain this season
Lmao po
Still love Po but she deserved the yellow
We can't get the ball out of the wrong end. And please get the drums more rhythmic.
Set piece suckage
It’s to the point they should just send the corners all the way back to Bixby and build all the way up again
Lol my partner and I were also noticing that they were terrible at offensive set pieces tonight…don’t think they got on the end of one of ‘em. Defensive have been a problem too, but my goodness what a waste tonight.
Norris IMMEDIATELY moves Weaver into a front two. Probs too little too late my dude!
Even making Soph yawn.
Slow and sloppy, woof Thorns
I am ready to move on from Bixby.
She slipped (like many players have in that box tonight) and made an awesome save on the Shaw FK. I’m a bixby skeptic generally and that was a frustrating goal to concede, but I find it hard to put that one fully on her.
Well...Mary Earps reportedly wants out at Manchester United! Not that we'd be able to offer the kind of dosh it would take...
Kling’s gotta come out at half
I think she’s cooked. It’s been a good run for her but I think it’s time for her to retire.
She has been so bad good lawd
I grimace almost as much when I see Kling starting as I do when I see Sinclair starting. I grimace a lot.
I would love to have Kling here next season for her leadership (esp with new ownership), and to be a supersub coming in as needed, but a starter she is not. I'm not fully sold on Reyes being a full time starter though., either...she's a bit inconsistent (though I think coaching and tactics make them both worse than they are.)
Generally agree. I think Kling’s leadership also brings the traditional WoSo 1.0 “in your face, score 15 goals a game” mentality. She (and others) are a barrier to attractive, cohesive, opportunistic, patient, fluid soccer. Liv is the future. Kling is not. The up and down, kind of all over the place, effort and results kind of makes me wonder about the locker room leadership. I can’t remember her wearing the captain’s armband, in recent years anyway. I don’t necessarily think the captains are getting the team on an even keel either.
Norris isn’t doing her any favors pushing her up, tho.
Both things are true. He does this every other game, and we also lose (or draw) every other game lol. The FBs stayed home more against the Reign, and, it worked better…as it does every time.
Hmmm…
Bizarre tactical to shift your only goal scorer out wide. You can’t set your team up like Hannah Betfort is Sophia Smith against this SD team.
There’s been a number of things wrong, but I have no idea why he changed it up after last week.
I am sick of watching us throw the ball in and losing it.
As I mentioned downthread, this team has been awful at throw-ins for as long as I can remember (and that's been since the team existed). It's odd: regardless of the lineup, coaching staff, opponent, etc., we suck at throw-ins. I don't get it...
The concept that “there’s no offside on throw-ins” seems to escape us.
Yes this, some. But the real problem is they seem to treat every throw-in as a chance to rest and regroup. They rarely just take the quick throw to the open player. And then since they're resting, they're not running or creating motion to get open. Almost never look for the long throw over the top either. Instead it's a short throw in traffic to a marked player with the idea that they'll be able to tap it back to the thrower who can pass out of the pressure. Only they're so tight there's no room. They basically turn every throw-in into a 50/50 ball. Oh, and they used to have Jessica McDonald, who's thows were nearly corners, thought they rarely used her.
“Rarely” doing a lot of work there. McDonald didn’t really develop that throw until she when to Carolina.
Disagree. Hard to show it when you're not on the field. That wasn't something she "developed." Just wasn't used
She was seen as a pure striker when she was here; she didn’t take throws; she was there to score. It wasn’t until she went to Carolina that Riley started using her for them.
Oh, that's a good observation! We never do seem to throw forward, do we?
Nope. Kling had Weaver lolling along the byline unmarked and hucked it into the crowd instead.
I’ve been tracking the throes this season, grouping them into “advanced tactical position/neutral ( neither gained nor lost)/lost possession or position”.
We’re roughly -10% on the positive AND negative throws - tend to have 10% fewer positive outcomes and 10% more negative ones.
I think a lot has to do with lack of motion off the ball. Our throws are typically to a player who’s already marked. The results are unsurprising.
/headdesk
This is going to be one of those nights, isn't it?
Yep. Slow, sloppy, panicky when pressed, Bixby w the big error, futile in front of goal. Just comprehensively ugly.
I'm considering switching to the Timbers match for the second half, something I seldom do.
Or just following loosely on my phone and heading over to Odori Park and enjoy a nice Sunday afternoon in Sapporo!
Either would be more fun than this. At this rate someone at kendo is gonna get a damn good whacking tomorrow morning…
Then again, it looks like the Timbers are stinking it up (at least defensively) too. Odori park it is!
Watching the shield slip away again.
Yep. Unfocused performances by all but a couple players, odd formation decision (put Weaver in the middle, FFS!), general lack of execution...
Debating shutting it off and heading out for a nice Sunday afternoon in the park (I live in Sapporo, Japan...) instead.
Oh, Crystal...can't head that right at Sheridan.
We're not sharp tonight. The passes aren't connecting and SD is taking advantage.
Dunn's having a sketchy match in terms of her passing accuracy and timing. Hopefully she'll clean it up a bit. The only player executing well is Hina.
She’ll want that shot back, tho. Weaver, too.
Disappointing concession in that it began with one of our typically crappy throw-ins that immediately conceded possession. This team has never been good at throw-ins for some reason.
Also, so far lots of possession with very little danger resulting. Predictable balls into the box, easily read and dealt with...
4-2-3-1 early, Betfort alone up top with hina and weaver out wide
San Diego didn't bring a traveling fan base with them. A bit of a trip but was hoping for something after LA did.
Betfort for Sinc tells me that we are planning on pressing hard
https://x.com/ThornsFC/status/1708294605702381857?s=20
Wow! Hina starts on short rest and Betfort over Sinc.
Not that short, really: the friendly v Argentina was on the 23rd, although it was followed by a couple-three days of training camp work (and travel, of course). Like most of the "first team," she was not part of the Asian Games roster.
The latter team is on quite a roll, btw, despite being mostly WE League journeywomen with only a handful of caps and high-schoolers. They only got scored on for the first time in the tournament in yesterday's 8-1 destruction of Philippines. Goal differential of 30 going into the semifinals...
Ah, I thought someone had said she played Thursday. Not a concern then, and very glad Norris didn’t bench her!
I was sharing incomplete and false information. I just saw Japan had a game on Google and figured she would be playing.
I’ll be curious to see how this looks. I’m assuming 4-3-3, but…Dunn and Moultrie as dual 8’s? Hina RF Betfort CF Weaver LF? That’s my best guess, but…
Moultrie isn’t starting- I’d assume the same as last week except Betfort in Sinc’s spot.
Rodriguez, then? She’s more like a 6/8 I’d think. Dunn as 8/10?
If it’s like last week, Coffey/Rocky double pivot with Rocky moving a little further forward, Hina and Dunn as wide 8s with Dunn playing more like a 10, and Betfort/Weaver up top.
That’s gonna be tough to break down their backline. It was tough in SD and we had Smith…
And indeed it was. We seemed set up for failure in this match